DIG UP THE GRAVES OF ABU BAKR AND UMAR - Grand Ayatollah Khorasani

[Rationalist]

[أبو ماريا المرزم]

 I cannot wait for the day when the filthy synagogue in Karbala is burned to the ground. And I make dua that when it happens, donkeys and horses will be brought in order for them to defecate in the pathetic excuse for a "masjid".

[MuslimAnswers]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xd6NAl5-DBU

^

Supposing the translation to be accurate (it is from our 'friends' at Yasser al-Habib's fellows), and the excerpt is quite short, yet there are a number of things to be seen: For one, is this task not meant to be accomplished when their 'occult Imam' returns so why the exhortation to do it now? Second, if a leading Shia scholar says this, why would the Shias get upset then when people from the other side call for the leveling of the graves in their 'Holy Cities' in Iraq and Iran - not exhuming or mutilating bodies, only leveling, a matter that would require a huge lot of violence to accomplish but not unlike what Khoraaani is calling for? (Note I am not talking about the Fiqh of whether this is what should actually be done, but about the Shias getting upset even though they are saying things like the above).

[AliTheBalkanic]

I cannot wait for the day when the filthy synagogue in Karbala is burned to the ground. And I make dua that when it happens, donkeys and horses will be brought in order for them to defecate in the pathetic excuse for a "masjid".

Brother i do agree that they litterally worship the grave but isnt it a bit much to say that horse should defecate in the place where Sayyidune Hussain (RA) is buried ?

[zaid_ibn_ali]

I cannot wait for the day when the filthy synagogue in Karbala is burned to the ground. And I make dua that when it happens, donkeys and horses will be brought in order for them to defecate in the pathetic excuse for a "masjid".

astaghfirullah

Nasibism in its extreme.

Why would you have so much hate for the pious grandson of the holy prophet SAW???

Repent!!!

This forum has so much useful info mashAllah but its tarnished by certain members who display their nasibi traits towards ahle bayt.
We do not exhagurate the ahle bayt nor do we speak of those pious ones of them with anything other than respect.

[Rationalist]

[
Supposing the translation to be accurate (it is from our 'friends' at Yasser al-Habib's fellows), and the excerpt is quite short, yet there are a number of things to be seen: For one, is this task not meant to be accomplished when their 'occult Imam' returns so why the exhortation to do it now? Second, if a leading Shia scholar says this, why would the Shias get upset then when people from the other side call for the leveling of the graves in their 'Holy Cities' in Iraq and Iran - not exhuming or mutilating bodies, only leveling, a matter that would require a huge lot of violence to accomplish but not unlike what Khoraaani is calling for? (Note I am not talking about the Fiqh of whether this is what should actually be done, but about the Shias getting upset even though they are saying things like the above).

The 12er Shia scholar is warming them up for that time to come. Also, this isn't only the belief of the Shrizaris. Even the unity types expect this event to occur.


https://youtu.be/XbpRVIEVVsU?t=480


Now look how another Qazwinis behaves with the Sunnis.

The above clip is all taqiyyah. This Qazwini above also believes the 2nd killed Fatima.

[MuslimAnswers]

The 12er Shia scholar is warming them up for that time to come. Also, this isn't only the belief of the Shrizaris. Even the unity types expect this event to occur.


https://youtu.be/XbpRVIEVVsU?t=480


Now look how another Qazwinis behaves with the Sunnis.

The above clip is all taqiyyah. This Qazwini above also believes the 2nd killed Fatima.

^

The first clip seems somewhat a small excerpt in terms of what it is saying, so I am sure "Unity" prone people will make it mean something else. However, at least Qazwini was honest in saying that there are Marjaiyah who do approve of La'n and Sabb to be directed against the Companions.

As you may know my position, I think the La'n and Sabb issue is minor in fact in this context, one has to concentrate on the Islam/Iman of the Companions in question, since for the Twelvers the Sabb/La'n comes as a consequence of the Shia believing that the Sahabah made disbelief of non-ambiguous tenets of faith [i.e. Divine Imamah], and their actions are judged from that basis. Any honest analysis would reveal such to be the case, and I don't think we should waste our time asking if they do La'n of anyone, knowing they deem them to be Kuffar regardless.

[Rationalist]

The first clip seems somewhat a small excerpt in terms of what it is saying, so I am sure "Unity" prone people will make it mean something else. However, at least Qazwini was honest in saying that there are Marjaiyah who do approve of La'n and Sabb to be directed against the Companions.

Yes the unity people will say unless you believe the 2 are monafiq you have nothing to worry about. On the contrary the clip shows they do hold a belief to remove dead bodies from the graves and give the dead Mortal Kombat fatalities.

Also what about Rajah? 

[MuslimAnswers]

^

One additional point about the second video of Mr. Qazwini: The scholars from our Sunni side also seem to let him and the Shia Marjaiyah off the hook extremely easily; basically what Mr. Qazwini was saying was that the La'n and Sabb is there in the Twelver religion, albeit differed upon by their top clerics.

The Sunni side should have retorted along the lines that fine, we are ready to disassociate ourselves from those who allow Sabb and to say that, as per our Fiqhi rules, there are physical and ideological consequences such as punishments, etc. to be meted out, plus other-worldly consequences; is Mr. Qazwini ready to join us in signing a joint declaration exhorting for the worldly punishments to be applied to these Marjaiyah and for a military task force to be set up in order to capture them and bring them to Islamic justice? (I am not certain about the exact language, but it should be taken very seriously, especially when the other side appears to be giving an opening of any sort).

[Rationalist]

I wouldn't want meanless fatwas such as the ones presented by Khamaeni.

[MuslimAnswers]

I wouldn't want meanless fatwas such as the ones presented by Khamaeni.

I am sure we Sunnis could do something about this in terms of political or economic pressure, though I am not familiar with politics or military realities. Yet I am sure Khamenei, if he wished, could formally criminalize La'n or Sabb of the Companions and legally prosecute those who do it either in their Holy Cities or wherever else, whether they are clerics or laymen. (Of course, the issue is that this culture of La'n is so ingrained within their religion that uprooting it would require a massive overhaul of their Deen, and this doesn't seem to be on the horizon whatsoever).

[MuslimAnswers]

I wouldn't want meanless fatwas such as the ones presented by Khamaeni.

I am sure we Sunnis could do something about this in terms of political or economic pressure, though I am not familiar with geopolitics or military strategies. Yet I am sure Khamenei, if he wished, could formally criminalize La'n or Sabb of the Companions and legally prosecute those who do it either in their Holy Cities or wherever else, whether they are clerics or laymen. (Of course, the issue is that this culture of La'n and of deeming the Companions as disbelievers is so ingrained within their religion that uprooting it would require a massive overhaul of their Deen and huge social upheaval/violence, and this doesn't seem to be on the horizon whatsoever; so much so even Sunni-majority countries leave the Twelvers to themselves).

[Rationalist]

No need for any of that. If I had power I would give 12er full freedom to curse and send lana since this is a pillar of their sect. On the contrary taqiyyah would be a big concern​ for me.

[MuslimAnswers]

No need for any of that. If I had power I would give 12er full freedom to curse and send lana since this is a pillar of their sect. On the contrary taqiyyah would be a big concern​ for me.

I was mostly referring to the ability for the Khameneist regime to enforce their views, which is something they already engage in anyway, so this would be in the pattern they already operate within. Concerning what we Sunnis in our own lands should do, this is a topic for our scholars to consider after going through the entirety of the Twelvers' current operational structure, though definitely all stripes of Sunnis (or those who call themselves Sunnis, no need for deep argument about that) have quite a lot to say about those who vilify the Companions with Kufr and what is entailed by that.

[Rationalist]

I was mostly referring to the ability for the Khameneist regime to enforce their views, which is something they already engage in anyway, so this would be in the pattern they already operate within.

Its useless. Iranian 12ers even with the fatwa for the companions can still blame Umar for the death of Fatima. Khamenei is such a coward that he would not  even allow a Sunni mosque to be build in Tehran. Even Nakshawani when he is aware that Sunnis in Iraq are being oppressed instead of listening he says they need to shut up.

Concerning what we Sunnis in our own lands should do, this is a topic for our scholars to consider after going through the entirety of the Twelvers' current operational structure, though definitely all stripes of Sunnis (or those who call themselves Sunnis, no need for deep argument about that) have quite a lot to say about those who vilify the Companions with Kufr and what is entailed by that.

Whatever we do its not going to work. The 12ers are like the Khawarij. The Khawarij hated Ali, and the 12ers hate Abi Bakr and Umar.

Did you see how Qazwini pulled a taqiyyah and managed to slip himself through. That's what the 12er Shia are going to do when anyone tries to corner them on the issue.

[Zlatan Ibrahimovic]

I cannot wait for the day when the filthy synagogue in Karbala is burned to the ground. And I make dua that when it happens, donkeys and horses will be brought in order for them to defecate in the pathetic excuse for a "masjid".

Yea, first of all it's not a synagogue. It's a masjid. Second of all that won't happen, because Allah will protect it. Third of all, donkeys and horses defecating next to the grave of the grandson of the Prophet? Doesn't sound good does it?

[Sheikh]

Brother i do agree that they litterally worship the grave but isnt it a bit much to say that horse should defecate in the place where Sayyidune Hussain (RA) is buried ?

What were Al-Lat and Al-Uzzah other than righteous people/saints that the common folk turned into gods?  And yet their idols were destroyed even though they themselves probably did nothing wrong.

[zaid_ibn_ali]

Tombs should be levelled to the ground as per the orders of Ameerulmumineen Ali ibn Abu Talib.

In regards to wishing such disgusting things upon the burial site of husayn ibn ali, how would you like your parents or childrens grave to be treated in such a way?
Think before you write.

Going back to the topic, Amirulmumineen Abu Bakr was the beloved companion of the holy prophet SAW in his life time till death & also his companion in the afterlife. Regardless of what any shia wishes.

[Hadrami]

Tombs should be levelled to the ground as per the orders of Ameerulmumineen Ali ibn Abu Talib.

In regards to wishing such disgusting things upon the burial site of husayn ibn ali, how would you like your parents or childrens grave to be treated in such a way?
Think before you write.

Going back to the topic, Amirulmumineen Abu Bakr was the beloved companion of the holy prophet SAW in his life time till death & also his companion in the afterlife. Regardless of what any shia wishes.

I doubt any sane sunni would defecate anyone's grave, not too mention Husein ra grave. I have never heard sunni defecate or dig up bodies from grave. As for shia digging up sunni grave & defecate on it, you only have to read what shia safavid king, Ismail 1 did to imam abu Hanifah's grave

[muslim720]

I cannot wait for the day when the filthy synagogue in Karbala is burned to the ground. And I make dua that when it happens, donkeys and horses will be brought in order for them to defecate in the pathetic excuse for a "masjid".

What you have posted is your own belief and I pray to Allah (swt) that you do not use the beliefs of ASWJ to substantiate your twisted, perverted, worth-condemning and abhorrent belief.