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Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine

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Husayn

Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« on: May 05, 2016, 05:23:52 AM »
I know this has been done to death. But I wanted to write a quick post highlighting (once again) how ridiculously bad the Shia explanation is. It is so bad that I guarantee you every Shi'i who knows Arabic and reads the Qur'an secretly admits that it's a horrible explanation (I myself did).

Verse:

Quote

وَقَرۡنَ فِى بُيُوتِكُنَّ وَلَا تَبَرَّجۡنَ تَبَرُّجَ ٱلۡجَـٰهِلِيَّةِ ٱلۡأُولَىٰۖ وَأَقِمۡنَ ٱلصَّلَوٰةَ وَءَاتِينَ ٱلزَّڪَوٰةَ وَأَطِعۡنَ ٱللَّهَ وَرَسُولَهُۚ ۥۤ إِنَّمَا يُرِيدُ ٱللَّهُ لِيُذۡهِبَ عَنڪُمُ ٱلرِّجۡسَ أَهۡلَ ٱلۡبَيۡتِ وَيُطَهِّرَكُمۡ تَطۡهِيرً۬ا


And stay quietly in your houses, and make not a dazzling display, like that of the former Times of Ignorance; and establish regular Prayer, and give regular Charity; and obey Allah and His Messenger. And Allah only wishes to remove all abomination from you, ye Members of the Family, and to make you pure and spotless.

Shi'a Explanation: The verse shifts from feminine to masculine (highlighted in red). This means it can't possible be referring to the Prophet (saws)'s wives, because they are females.

The average Shi'i eats this explanation up without questioning. The more knowledgeable Shi'i probablly gets a pain in his gut when using this to "refute" Ahlul Sunnah.

Quick rebuttal 1:

Quote
وَٱمۡرَأَتُهُ ۥ قَآٮِٕمَةٌ۬ فَضَحِكَتۡ فَبَشَّرۡنَـٰهَا بِإِسۡحَـٰقَ وَمِن وَرَآءِ إِسۡحَـٰقَ يَعۡقُوبَ

قَالَتۡ يَـٰوَيۡلَتَىٰٓ ءَأَلِدُ وَأَنَا۟ عَجُوزٌ۬ وَهَـٰذَا بَعۡلِى شَيۡخًا‌ۖ إِنَّ هَـٰذَا لَشَىۡءٌ عَجِيبٌ۬

قَالُوٓاْ أَتَعۡجَبِينَ مِنۡ أَمۡرِ ٱللَّهِ‌ۖ رَحۡمَتُ ٱللَّهِ وَبَرَكَـٰتُهُ ۥ عَلَيۡكُمۡ أَهۡلَ ٱلۡبَيۡتِ‌ۚ إِنَّهُ ۥ حَمِيدٌ۬ مَّجِيدٌ۬


And his wife was standing (there), and she laughed: but We gave her glad tidings of Isaac, and after him of Jacob. (71)

She said: "Alas for me! Shall I bear a child, seeing I am an old woman, and my husband here is an old man? That would indeed be a wonderful thing!" (72)

They said: "Dost thou wonder at Allah's decree? The grace of Allah and His blessings on you, O ye people of the house! for He is indeed worthy of all praise, full of all glory!"

Angel comes to Ibrahim (as)'s wife and informs her she's having children. She freaks out, the Angel reprimands her and refers to her as "Ahlul Bayt".

Quick rebuttal 2:

Quote
وَحَرَّمۡنَا عَلَيۡهِ ٱلۡمَرَاضِعَ مِن قَبۡلُ فَقَالَتۡ هَلۡ أَدُلُّكُمۡ عَلَىٰٓ أَهۡلِ بَيۡتٍ۬ يَكۡفُلُونَهُ ۥ لَڪُمۡ وَهُمۡ لَهُ ۥ نَـٰصِحُونَ

فَرَدَدۡنَـٰهُ إِلَىٰٓ أُمِّهِۦ كَىۡ تَقَرَّ عَيۡنُهَا وَلَا تَحۡزَنَ وَلِتَعۡلَمَ أَنَّ وَعۡدَ ٱللَّهِ حَقٌّ۬ وَلَـٰكِنَّ أَڪۡثَرَهُمۡ لَا يَعۡلَمُونَ


And We ordained that he refused suck at first, until (his sister came up and) said: "Shall I point out to you the people of a house that will nourish and bring him up for you and be sincerely attached to him?"… (12)

Thus did We restore him to his mother that her eye might be comforted, that she might not grieve and that she might know that the promise of Allah is true: but most of them do not understand. (13)

Moussa (as)'s sister says to Pharoah's people that she'll find a "people of a house" (Ahli Baytin) to take care of Moussa (as). Very next verse states he was returned to his mother. Once again, Ahlul Bayt is used to refer to a female.

Quick rebuttal 3:
Quote

وَهَلۡ أَتَٮٰكَ حَدِيثُ مُوسَىٰٓ

إِذۡ رَءَا نَارً۬ا فَقَالَ لِأَهۡلِهِ ٱمۡكُثُوٓاْ إِنِّىٓ ءَانَسۡتُ نَارً۬ا لَّعَلِّىٓ ءَاتِيكُم مِّنۡہَا بِقَبَسٍ أَوۡ أَجِدُ عَلَى ٱلنَّارِ هُدً۬ى

Has the story of Moses reached thee? (9)

Behold, he saw a fire: so he said to his family "Tarry ye; I perceive a fire; perhaps I can bring you some burning brand therefrom or find some guidance at the fire." (10)

Moussa (as) sees a fire and tells his "Ahl" to stay behind while he explores. Who was with Moussa (as)? His wife ofcourse. Again, the male "Ahl" is used to refer to a female.

To Shias: Your scholars laugh at you with these explanations, they themselves know that they are pathetically bad, but they count on your ignorance to get away with it.
إن يتبعون إلا الظن وما تهوى الأنفس

Farid

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #1 on: May 05, 2016, 11:41:22 AM »
Mashallah. Where has this acadrmic zeal come from? You've been quiet for a while.

Ijtaba

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #2 on: May 05, 2016, 01:25:11 PM »
Quick rebuttal 2:

Quote
وَحَرَّمۡنَا عَلَيۡهِ ٱلۡمَرَاضِعَ مِن قَبۡلُ فَقَالَتۡ هَلۡ أَدُلُّكُمۡ عَلَىٰٓ أَهۡلِ بَيۡتٍ۬ يَكۡفُلُونَهُ ۥ لَڪُمۡ وَهُمۡ لَهُ ۥ نَـٰصِحُونَ

فَرَدَدۡنَـٰهُ إِلَىٰٓ أُمِّهِۦ كَىۡ تَقَرَّ عَيۡنُهَا وَلَا تَحۡزَنَ وَلِتَعۡلَمَ أَنَّ وَعۡدَ ٱللَّهِ حَقٌّ۬ وَلَـٰكِنَّ أَڪۡثَرَهُمۡ لَا يَعۡلَمُونَ


And We ordained that he refused suck at first, until (his sister came up and) said: "Shall I point out to you the people of a house that will nourish and bring him up for you and be sincerely attached to him?"… (12)

Thus did We restore him to his mother that her eye might be comforted, that she might not grieve and that she might know that the promise of Allah is true: but most of them do not understand. (13)

Moussa (as)'s sister says to Pharoah's people that she'll find a "people of a house" (Ahli Baytin) to take care of Moussa (as). Very next verse states he was returned to his mother. Once again, Ahlul Bayt is used to refer to a female.

I have a question why did Nabi Musa (a.s) sister say to the people of Fira'wn people of the house instead of woman or wet-nurse? It seems strange to call one person as people. And why would she say people of the house. What was the significance of the house? It would be much better if she would had said people of Hebrew origin or people of Abraham etc.

Optimus Prime

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #3 on: May 05, 2016, 02:16:40 PM »
I likie.

Husayn

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #4 on: May 05, 2016, 03:08:46 PM »
I have a question why did Nabi Musa (a.s) sister say to the people of Fira'wn people of the house instead of woman or wet-nurse?

In Arabic, when one hears "Ahlul Bayt", he immediately thinks of women. It is a term which is almost exclusively used to refer to women. So saying "Ahlul Bayt" is like saying "women" or "woman".
إن يتبعون إلا الظن وما تهوى الأنفس

Ijtaba

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #5 on: May 05, 2016, 04:57:05 PM »
I have a question why did Nabi Musa (a.s) sister say to the people of Fira'wn people of the house instead of woman or wet-nurse?

In Arabic, when one hears "Ahlul Bayt", he immediately thinks of women. It is a term which is almost exclusively used to refer to women. So saying "Ahlul Bayt" is like saying "women" or "woman".

So your saying that Nabi Musa (a.s) sister spoke Arabic to the people of Firaw'n and people of Firaw'n also understood Arabic as by her saying People of the House they (people of Firaw'n) understood it to mean "woman" like normal Arabs would do?

Noor-us-Sunnah

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #6 on: May 05, 2016, 05:30:59 PM »
Anyone interested in this topic should read these articles too:

Why did KUM(Masculine plural) come in 33:33 instead of KUNNA(feminine plural)?

https://youpuncturedtheark.wordpress.com/2010/10/07/ahlahlebayt-a-collective-noun-and-its-usage/


Usage of word Ahl/Ahlebayt in Quran
https://youpuncturedtheark.wordpress.com/2010/10/06/usage-of-word-ahlahlebayt-in-quran/

Husayn

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #7 on: May 06, 2016, 02:48:05 AM »
I have a question why did Nabi Musa (a.s) sister say to the people of Fira'wn people of the house instead of woman or wet-nurse?

In Arabic, when one hears "Ahlul Bayt", he immediately thinks of women. It is a term which is almost exclusively used to refer to women. So saying "Ahlul Bayt" is like saying "women" or "woman".

So your saying that Nabi Musa (a.s) sister spoke Arabic to the people of Firaw'n and people of Firaw'n also understood Arabic as by her saying People of the House they (people of Firaw'n) understood it to mean "woman" like normal Arabs would do?


I am saying that the Qur'an is in Arabic, and that it is full of Arabic terms, so the Arabs, to whom it was revealed, could understand it.

When they read that Musa (as)'s sister said to Pharoah's people "I'll find an Ahlul Bayt", they understood it as "I'll find some women of a house".
إن يتبعون إلا الظن وما تهوى الأنفس

GreatChineseFall

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #8 on: May 06, 2016, 03:47:14 AM »
In addition, regarding the self-imposed and invented myth that a wife can be called Ahl only if she has children, don't forget about this verse:
Quote
    وَاسْتَبَقَا الْبَابَ وَقَدَّتْ قَمِيصَهُ مِن دُبُرٍ وَأَلْفَيَا سَيّدَهَا لَدَي الْبَابِ قَالَتْ مَا جَزَآءُ مَنْ أَرَادَ بِاَهْلِكَ سُوءاً إِلآَّ أَن يُسْجَنَ أَوْ عَذَابٌ أَلِيمٌ

25. “And they both raced to the door and she tore his shirt form the back. They both found her husband by the door. She said: ‘What is the punishment for him who intends evil to your wife (to your Ahl) save he be imprisoned or a painful chastisement?’”

This could not refer to anything but the wife of al Aziz. It is regarding Zulaykha and I keep bumping into statements that she was childless in different tafaseer and other books.

The commentators of "An Enlightening Commentary into the Light of the Holy Qur'an" at al-islam.org seem to have no issue with it and even claims that that is one of the reasons why she wanted to seduce prophet Yusuf in the first place:
Quote
Other factors also helped to inflame Zulaykha’s burning desire for him.

On the one hand, she was childless and lived a luxurious and aristocratic life, and on the other hand, she had no domestic conflicts or problems in her life which left her with ample time to engage in fantasy and plan schemes.

Maybe it will be hard to confirm but if somebody knows anything about it especially from shia sources, please do share. That would bury this myth deeper into the  ground.

Ijtaba

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2016, 06:56:34 PM »
I am saying that the Qur'an is in Arabic, and that it is full of Arabic terms, so the Arabs, to whom it was revealed, could understand it.

When they read that Musa (as)'s sister said to Pharoah's people "I'll find an Ahlul Bayt", they understood it as "I'll find some women of a house".

Some women of a house.. which house?

If there was a man instead of Nabi Musa's (as) sister then it would make sense that he is referring to his wife by saying Ahlul Bayt. The arabic word "Ahl" means "People" in English language e.g. Ahlul Kahf (People of the Cave), Ahlul Qurra (People of the Town), Ahlul Medina (People of the City), Ahlul Kitab (People of the Book), etc.

However when it is applied to a man for e.g. when a man says "My Ahl" then the man is referring to his wife and children if the man has children or to his wife if the man is childless. The word Ahl does include man's children and is not restricted to wife alone.

In the case of Hadhrat Ibrahim (a.s) and Hadhrat Sarah (s.a) their son Hadhrat Ishaq (a.s) and grandson Hadhrat Yaqub (a.s) are also included in term "Ahlul Bayt." Hadhrat Ishaq (a.s) and Hadhrat Yaqub (a.s) are also part of Ahlul Bayt of Ibrahim (a.s).


Hani

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2016, 08:08:13 PM »
No they're not included since they weren't born. (Ishaq and Ya`qoub)

Ijtaba, what are you debating exactly? Is it just debate for the sake of debate or do you have a point?
عَلامَةُ أَهْلِ الْبِدَعِ الْوَقِيعَةُ فِي أَهْلِ الأَثَرِ. وَعَلامَةُ الْجَهْمِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُشَبِّهَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الْقَدَرِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُجَبِّرَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الزَّنَادِقَةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ الأَثَرِ حَشْوِيَّةً

Religion = simple & clear

Noor-us-Sunnah

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2016, 08:20:30 PM »
I am saying that the Qur'an is in Arabic, and that it is full of Arabic terms, so the Arabs, to whom it was revealed, could understand it.

When they read that Musa (as)'s sister said to Pharoah's people "I'll find an Ahlul Bayt", they understood it as "I'll find some women of a house".

Some women of a house.. which house?

If there was a man instead of Nabi Musa's (as) sister then it would make sense that he is referring to his wife by saying Ahlul Bayt. The arabic word "Ahl" means "People" in English language e.g. Ahlul Kahf (People of the Cave), Ahlul Qurra (People of the Town), Ahlul Medina (People of the City), Ahlul Kitab (People of the Book), etc.

Example 2:

وَحَرَّمْنَا عَلَيْهِ الْمَرَاضِعَ مِن قَبْلُ فَقَالَتْ هَلْ أَدُلُّكُمْ عَلَى أَهْلِ بَيْتٍ يَكْفُلُونَهُ لَكُمْ وَهُمْ لَهُ نَاصِحُونَ

And we ordained that he refused suck at first, until (His sister came up and) said: “Shall I point out to you the people of a house(ahli bayt) that will nourish and bring him up for you and be sincerely attached to him?”.(28:12)

Even in the verse above the mother of Moses(as) is termed as ahlebayt, not because she was mother of a prophet, but because she was the wife of Imran. And some people like shia scholar aqa pooya mahdi whose tafseer is refered by popular shia website al-islam.org  have completely misunderstood this verse, they think that here mother of Moses(as) was termed ahlebayt because she was mother of a prophet, no this is wrong understanding because, the statements which the sister of Moses(as) made , were to the soldiers of firawn , if the sister of Moses(as) was addressing the lady with term ahlebayt because she was mother of Moses(as), then the people there would surely would have questioned her that who is the mother of his child and why did she put the baby in the river and then everything would have been messed up.

Similar is said by a different shia tafseer:

(The agents of Pharaoh became happy by that statement and began going with her toward that lady. Moses’ sister, who showed herself as an unacquainted person and a stranger, informed the mother of the matter.) (The Light of The Holy Qur’an  by Ayatullah Sayyid Kamal Faghih Imani and A Group of Muslim Scholars, under explanation of verse 20:40)

And if people use their common sense then they can understand this verse easily that, in no way the sister of Moses(as) was signifying any relation between the child and mother of Moses(as), had she done so, she would have been in deep trouble. But infact she addressed mother of Moses(as) with “ahlebayt” because of being the wife of a  person(Imran).

Its is possible that after reading  convincing response to the illogical arguments raised by them, the shia might try to take a U-turn with their theories , they might say that in this verse a complete household is being addressed, not just a single lady. So to such arguments we answer from the Quran itself . Because  the best way is to explain the Quran is through the Quran. For, what the Quran alludes to at one place is explained at the other, and what it says in brief on one occasion is elaborated upon at the other.

Quran says: See how We repeat the verses that they may understand.” (6:65)

“And certainly We have repeated for mankind in this Quran, every kind of similitude, but the majority of mankind do not consent to aught but denying.” (17:89)

Its clear from quran that there was no need for a complete household, But just a single woman who could nurse the child. So why would sister of Moses(as) refer to a complete household? Moreover another verse of quran is more clear to solve the confusion that was it a complete household addressed by sister of moses(as) or just a single lady with the term “ahlebayt” ?

Your sister went to them and said, “May I show you “someone” who will nurse this child?”(sarwar shia translator, 20:40)

Even explained similarly by shia commentators:She told the men of Pharaoh whether she introduced a “woman” to them who was able to nurse the baby. The verse continues saying: (“…’Shall I direct you to one who will nurse him?’ …”) Maybe, she added that this “woman” had a pure milk so that she was sure that the child would accept it. (The Light of The Holy Qur’an  by Ayatullah Sayyid Kamal Faghih Imani and A Group of Muslim Scholars, under explanation of verse 20:40)  )

From popular Shia website, Al-Islam.org, which contains the authentic Shia Tafseer of Pooya/M.A. Ali. :When it was picked by Firawn’s family and they seemed to love the child, she appeared before them and promised to bring a good “wet–nurse” for the child.(pooya ali, tafseer al islam.org  20:40)

Similar is said in another shia tafseer i.e Tafseer namuna vol 7, page 359

Even sunni commentators explain the same:

she then said, “Shall I show you “someone” who will take care of him?”. Her offer was accepted and so she brought [them] his “mother” and he took to her breasts.(tafseer jalalayn 20:40)

She meant , “Shall I guide you to “someone” who can nurse him for you for a fee” So she took him and they went with her to his real mother.(tafseer ibn katheer, 20:40)

Quran itself answers such misunderstandings , where it clears that sister of moses(as) referred to single women “someone”… the Qur’an is its own best commentary . As we proceed with the study of the Book, we find how true this is. A careful comparison and collation of passages from the Qur’an removes many difficulties.

And moreover if for an instance for sake of argument we agree that it was a complete household addressed, even then no one can deny that fact that, mother of Moses(as) was included in it, and not because of being the mother of the child, as we explained why, but because being the wife of Imran.
https://youpuncturedtheark.wordpress.com/2010/10/06/usage-of-word-ahlahlebayt-in-quran/


Quote
In the case of Hadhrat Ibrahim (a.s) and Hadhrat Sarah (s.a) their son Hadhrat Ishaq (a.s) and grandson Hadhrat Yaqub (a.s) are also included in term "Ahlul Bayt." Hadhrat Ishaq (a.s) and Hadhrat Yaqub (a.s) are also part of Ahlul Bayt of Ibrahim (a.s).
Example 5:

قَالُواْ أَتَعْجَبِينَ مِنْ أَمْرِ اللّهِ رَحْمَتُ اللّهِ وَبَرَكَاتُهُ عَلَيْكُمْ أَهْلَ الْبَيْتِ إِنَّهُ حَمِيدٌ مَّجِيدٌ

She said: O wonder! shall I bear a son when I am an extremely old woman and this my husband an extremely old man? Most surely this is a wonderful thing. They said: Do you wonder at Allah’s bidding? The mercy of Allah and His blessings are on you, O people of the house(ahlebayt), surely He is Praised, Glorious.(11:72-73)

In this verse too, wife of hz ibrahim(as) is addressed as ahlebayt, And she was addressed because of being wife of hz ibrahim(as), As explained by quran itself in another chapter:
فَرَاغَ إِلَىٰ أَهْلِهِ فَجَاءَ بِعِجْلٍ سَمِينٍ
He went quietly to his wife(ahlihi) and returned to his guests with a fat, roasted calf.(51:26, sarwar shia translator)) .

Ijtaba

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #12 on: May 06, 2016, 10:09:46 PM »
No they're not included since they weren't born. (Ishaq and Ya`qoub)

Ijtaba, what are you debating exactly? Is it just debate for the sake of debate or do you have a point?

I am not debating nor do I want to prove a point. I just didn't understand how could "Ahlul Bayt" refer to wife in the case of Nabi Musa (a.s) sister. If Nabi Musa (a.s) sister had said "Ahlul Bayt of Imran (a.s)" then it would had made more sense that she is referring to wife of Imran (a.s).

Are Nabi Ishaq (a.s), Nabi Yaqub (a.s) (when they were born) not included in Ahlul Bayt of Ibrahim (a.s)? Are Hadhrat Hajra (s.a) and Nabi Ismael (a.s) not part of Ahlul Bayt of Ibrahim (a.s)?

GreatChineseFall

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #13 on: May 07, 2016, 03:29:43 AM »

I am not debating nor do I want to prove a point. I just didn't understand how could "Ahlul Bayt" refer to wife in the case of Nabi Musa (a.s) sister. If Nabi Musa (a.s) sister had said "Ahlul Bayt of Imran (a.s)" then it would had made more sense that she is referring to wife of Imran (a.s).


Is the confusion maybe the fact that it's not Ahl al Bayt, as in a defined household, "people of the household", but Ahl Bayt, an undefined household, people of a household?
She was basically saying, shall I point you to "some" household/wife and not "the" household/wife as if they knew what she was talking about. Otherwise, I don't understand where the confusion comes from.

Qalander Rafidhi

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #14 on: May 07, 2016, 12:23:26 PM »
Sahih Muslim
Book Of Merits of Ali Ibn Abi Talib (as)
Hadith 5920
Yazid b. Hayyan reported, I went along with Husain b. Sabra and 'Umar b. Muslim to Zaid b. Arqam and, as we sat by his side, Husain said to him: Zaid. you have been able to acquire a great virtue that you saw Allaah's Messenger (sallAllaahu alayhi wa sallam) listened to his talk, fought by his side in (different) battles, offered prayer behind me. Zaid, you have in fact earned a great virtue. Zaid, narrate to us what you heard from Allaah's Messenger (sallAllaahu alayhi wa sallam). He said: I have grown old and have almost spent my age and I have forgotten some of the things which I remembered in connection with Allaah's Messenger (sallAllaahu alayhi wa sallam), so accept whatever I narrate to you, and which I do not narrate do not compel me to do that. He then said: One day Allaah's Messenger (sallAllaahu alayhi wa sallam) stood up to deliver sermon at a watering place known as Khumm situated between Mecca and Medina. He praised Allaah, extolled Him and delivered the sermon and. exhorted (us) and said: Now to our purpose. O people, I am a human being. I am about to receive a messenger (the angel of death) from my Lord and I, in response to Allaah's call, (would bid good-bye to you), but I am leaving among you two weighty things: the one being the Book of Allaah in which there is right guidance and light, so hold fast to the Book of Allaah and adhere to it. He exhorted (us) (to hold fast) to the Book of Allaah and then said: The second are the members of my household I remind you (of your duties) to the members of my family. He (Husain) said to Zaid: Who are the members of his household? Aren't his wives the members of his family? Thereupon he said: His wives are the members of his family (but here) the members of his family are those for whom acceptance of Zakat is forbidden. And he said: Who are they? Thereupon he said: 'Ali and the offspring of 'Ali, 'Aqil and the offspring of 'Aqil and the offspring of Ja'far and the offspring of 'Abbas. Husain said: These are those for whom the acceptance of Zakat is forbidden. Zaid said: Yes.

There is a distinction between the wives and the blood relatives according to Sahih Muslim
Ya Ali (as) Madad

Noor-us-Sunnah

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #15 on: May 07, 2016, 02:42:26 PM »
But both were considered Ahlulbayt. That is the wives as well as blood relatives. In the case of Hadeeth Thaqalayn, what Zaid(RA) meant was the blood relatives, who should be taken care of after Prophet(SAWS), since they weren't eligilbe to receive charity.

Qalander Rafidhi

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #16 on: May 09, 2016, 01:32:33 AM »
But both were considered Ahlulbayt. That is the wives as well as blood relatives. In the case of Hadeeth Thaqalayn, what Zaid(RA) meant was the blood relatives, who should be taken care of after Prophet(SAWS), since they weren't eligilbe to receive charity.

If they weren't supposed to take from charity then how come Abu Bakr said that the family of the prophet could eat from the land of Fadak if it was truly charity ? Was he not aware of this hadith ? He also said that he's doing things in accordance with the prophet's (sawa) saying, so did he lie or not ?
Ya Ali (as) Madad

Husayn

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #17 on: May 09, 2016, 02:41:49 AM »
Stop trying to sidetrack the topic.

You cannot hide your shame - the Shia explanation of verse 33:33 is a joke, and it is refuted by multiple verses of the Qur'an.
إن يتبعون إلا الظن وما تهوى الأنفس

Hani

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #18 on: May 09, 2016, 03:57:22 AM »

If they weren't supposed to take from charity then how come Abu Bakr said that the family of the prophet could eat from the land of Fadak if it was truly charity ? Was he not aware of this hadith ? He also said that he's doing things in accordance with the prophet's (sawa) saying, so did he lie or not ?

Fadak was made a Waqf, he (saw) said "My family may eat from it". What's your issue? You disagree with the Prophet (saw)?

The Waqf he (saw) left had two purposes A- Feeding his family B- A charity to the needy. Please research before making accusations.

As Hysayn said, stop trying to side track with weak diversions.
عَلامَةُ أَهْلِ الْبِدَعِ الْوَقِيعَةُ فِي أَهْلِ الأَثَرِ. وَعَلامَةُ الْجَهْمِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُشَبِّهَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الْقَدَرِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُجَبِّرَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الزَّنَادِقَةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ الأَثَرِ حَشْوِيَّةً

Religion = simple & clear

Qalander Rafidhi

Re: Verse 33:33 - Gender change from feminine to masculine
« Reply #19 on: May 09, 2016, 04:03:57 AM »
Listen, brother. In sahih muslim it clearly says that abu bakr claimed that the prophet (sawa) said, whatever we leave is to be given in charity and whatever we have is also charity. If the property belonged to Prophet Muhamnad (sawa) even as waqf then who should take care of it's endowment, his immediate family or Abu Bakr ?

In every hadith it says it was to be given in sadaqa and Ahlul Bayt (as) can't eat from sadaqa, so why did Abu Bakr offer it to them and why did Prophet Muhammad (sawa) eat from it when fadak was being maintained by him ?
Ya Ali (as) Madad

 

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