I've seen on Rafidichat, on several Arab forums and lately a brother asking on this very forum a shubha (doubt) in regards to 'Omar (may Allah be pleased with him). Ive also listened to this shubha in one of the lectures of Yasser Al-Khabith. Honestly, he's such a jahil just like all their 'scholars'. They literally try to get their hands on anything just in order to discredit the Sahabah, while at the same time rejecting and ignoraning rock-solid-sahih-chain narrations where the Ahl Al-Bayt explicitly praised the likes of Abu Bakr and Omar, even after their demise.
"Get off the minbar of my father/Come down from the minbar of my father"
This is a statement attributed to both Al-Hassan (who said it to Abu Bakr) and Al-Hussein (who said it to 'Omar). You can probably imagine how the desperate Rafidah who are masters in turning any narration into an attack and even takfir on most of the Sahabah, in particular Abu Bakr and 'Omar, are rejoicing and thinking they've found something to beat the Ahl Al-Sunnah with. Little do they know that as usual they are shooting in their own feet.
Often you find the deceitful Rafidah cutting large chunks of the narration we will be discussing, in particular the last part of it which simply destroy not just the hateful narrative they try to champion, but in fact their entire religion. Take for example this English Rafidi website (that has been literally destroyed by twelvershia.net, we have a whole section refuting them)that only quotes the beginning of the narration:
Yet the complete narration goes like this :
(the red part is omitted by Shia propagandists online such as by the Wilayat website)
الذهبي - سير أعلام النبلاء
- حماد بن زيد : ، حدثنا : يحيى بن سعيد الأنصاري ، عن عبيد بن حنين ، عن الحسين ، قال : صعدت المنبر إلى عمر ، فقلت : نزل ، عن منبر أبي ، وإذهب إلى منبر أبيك ، فقال : إن أبي لم يكن له منبر ! فأقعدني معه ، فلما نزل ، قال : أي بني ! من علمك هذا ؟ ، قلت : ما علمنيه أحد ، قال : أي بني ! وهل أنبت على رؤوسنا الشعر إلاّ الله ، ثم أنتم ! ووضع يده على رأسه ، وقال : أي بني ! لو جعلت تأتينا وتغشانا ، إسناده صحيح.
[...] Oِn the authority of Al-Hussein [Ibn Ali Ibn Abi Talib] who said:
I went to Omar while he was given a sermon over the minbar (pulpit). I ascended to him and said: "Come down from the minbar of my father, and go to the minbar of your father!".
Omar answered: "My father had no pulpit". At this time Omar got down from the minbar, and sat me on the minbar beside him and while he was descending he said: "O my son! Who taught you this?" I (Al-Hussein) said: "Nobody taught me this." He (Omar) said: "O my son, and is there anyone else besides Allah and then you (Rasulullah and Ahl Al-Bayt) who honoured us!" Then he (Omar) put his hand on Al-Hussein's head [...]
[Chain is sahih according to Al-Dhahabi. Narrated also by Al-Dhahabi, Ibn 'Asakir, Ibn Hajr, Al-Khatib Al-Baghdadi]
In another version we can read how Ali, the father of Al-Hussein (may Allah be pleased with him) himself reacted, proving that Al-Hussein said what he said due to him being a child (not an infallible Imam) and Ali (if at all it should be him saying something like that first, not his little kids) harshly criticised him for that (as any decent father would do):
'Omar Ibn Al-Khattab used to give the khutbah on the minbar. Al-Hussein ibn ‘Ali, may Allah be pleased with him, stood up before him and said, ‘Come down from my father’s minbar.’ ‘Omar said, ‘It is the minbar of your father and not the minbar of my father. Who told you to do this?’ ‘
Ali stood and said, ‘By Allah, no-one told him to do this. I will certainly cause you (Al-Hussein) some pain, traitor.’ He (‘Omar) said, ‘
Don’t hurt the son of my brother, for he has told the truth, it is the minbar of his father.’
[Tarikh Al-Khulafa of Imam Al-Suyuti]
Yet, the Rafidah not just back in the time of ink and paper only, but even in the 21st century do not shy away from tadlis and talbis (satanic deception), even on social media they make nice looking posters,
omitting the end part of the narration (that has been narrated in various similar version) in order to increase the hatred of their blind (and fooled) followers for 'Omar Ibn Al-Khattab, omitted large chunks of the narration that proves the beautiful character of Omar and love of the Ahl Al-Bayt for 'Omar:
Open minded Shias who really long for nothing but the truth should really ask themselves why their scholars and propagandists hide the truth, why they omit large chunks of such a narration?! Is it anything but blind hatred and pure bias? Is it anything but the desire of throwing accusations and making takfir against Omar Ibn Al-Khattab? Is this the Islam they want to preach? Is this the peaceful Islam of the Household as they claim? Ironically they accuse others of being extremists and takfiris, yet Shia scholars and propagandists are even ready to cut and paste bits of a narration that has nothing to do with their hateful narrative just in order to portray 'Omar as an evil usurper.
As for Al-Hussein's statement:
As you can see, the Shia believe they have found more food to nuture their hatred and their ideology which is purely based on portraying the Ahl Al-Bayt and the rest of the Sahaba (except less than a handful) as constant arch enemies.
What they (in their deception) do not mention is a very important and crucial point, namely that Al-Hussein was a child during the reign of Omar and during that incident. Al-Husseinwas born in the 4th year Hijri and Rasulullah (peace be upon him) passed away in 11th Hijri. Al-Hussein was only 6 to 7 years old. The narration is in fact a prove against the Shia and not for them and this from many angles. I'll mention a few points (partly translated from Fnoor Arabic website, the graveyard of Rafidism, but I've added some points myself, so it's not a word for word translation), by the permission and with the help of Allah only:
1)
أن الحسين رضي الله عنه كان صغيرا في السن حين خلافة عمر بن الخطاب رضي الله عنه، وقد جاء في رواية إسحاق بلفظ ثم أخذني رضي الله عنه بين يديه ، فجعلت أقلب حصى في يدي) وفي رواية فأقعدني على المنبر معه ، وفي رواية (ووضع يده رضي الله عنه على رأسه)، فكلامه رضي الله عنه كان حين صغره ، والكلام في حال الصغر ليس مثل الكلام في حال اكتمال العقل ، ولأن هذا التصرف وهو أن يصعد إلى منبر الخليفة ويقول له هذا الكلام ليس من تصرف الرجل الرشيد.
Al-Hussein was a child during the years of Omar's rule. In another version we read the following wording: "
... He (Omar) then took me and held me with his two hands." And in another narration it is mentioned "
... At this time he sat me on the minbar beside him.." And in another narration it is mentioned "
... he put his hands on my head". So he (Al-Hussein) is narrating what he said (his reaction when he saw Omar) as a child, and the reaction and the wordings of a child are different to that of an grown up [...]
2)
أن المقصود بقول الحسين رضي الله عنه (منبر أبي) أي منبر النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم ، ولم يقصد منبر والده علي بن أبي طالب رضي الله عنه.
Al-Hussein's wording (get off the minbar of my father) was in regards to his grandfather Rasulullah (peace be upon him) who was like a father to him and even called Al-Hassan and Al-Hussein his sons. The Prophet (peace be upon him) referred to Al-Hassan as his son when he said, "This son of mine is a Sayyid and Almighty God will arrange peace between two groups through him." Many times the Prophet had said,"Hassan and Hussein are my children". Because of these same words Ali would say to his other children, "You are my children and Hassan and Hussein are the children of the Prophet."
http://www.ziaraat.org/hassan.php (that is a Shia website)
And if this is not proof enough here a authentic sahih narration, with the wording JADDI (my grandfather):
جزاكم الله خيرا ، ويؤيد ما ذهبتم إليه رواية ابن شبة للأثر ، فقال (3/ 798) :
حَدَّثَنَا الْحِزَامِيُّ، قَالَ: حَدَّثَنَا عَبْدُ اللَّهِ بْنُ وَهْبٍ، قَالَ: أَخْبَرَنِي يُونُسُ، عَنِ ابْنِ شِهَابٍ، قَالَ: أَخْبَرَنِي عَبْدُ اللَّهِ بْنُ كَعْبٍ:
" أَنَّ حُسَيْنَ بْنَ عَلِيٍّ رَضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُمَا قَامَ إِلَى عُمَرَ رَضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُ وَهُوَ عَلَى مِنْبَرِ رَسُولِ اللَّهِ صَلَّى اللهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ يَخْطُبُ النَّاسَ يَوْمَ الْجُمُعَةِ , فَقَالَ: انْزِلْ عَنْ مِنْبَرِ جَدِّي، فَقَالَ عُمَرُ رَضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُ: «تَأَخَّرْ يَا ابْنَ أَخِي» ، قَالَ: وَأَخَذَ حُسَيْنٌ بِرِدَاءِ عُمَرَ رَضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُمَا فَلَمْ يَزَلْ يَجْبِذُهُ وَيَقُولُ: انْزِلْ عَنْ مِنْبَرِ جَدِّي، وَتَرَدَّدَ عَلَيْهِ حَتَّى قَطَعَ خُطْبَتَهُ وَنَزَلَ عَنِ الْمِنْبَرِ، وَأَقَامَ الصَّلَاةَ، فَلَمَّا صَلَّى أَرْسَلَ إِلَى حُسَيْنٍ رَضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُ فَلَمَّا جَاءَهُ قَالَ: «يَا ابْنَ أَخِي مَنْ أَمَرَكَ بِالَّذِي صَنَعْتَ؟» قَالَ حُسَيْنٌ: مَا أَمَرَنِي بِهِ أَحَدٌ، قَالَ: يَقُولُ لَهُ ذَلِكَ حُسَيْنٌ ثَلَاثَ مَرَّاتٍ، كُلَّ ذَلِكَ يَقُولُ: مَا أَمَرَنِي بِهِ أَحَدٌ، قَالَ عُمَرُ رَضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُ: «أَوَ لِي؟» وَلَمْ يَزِدْ عَلَى ذَلِكَ، وَحُسَيْنٌ رَضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُ يَوْمَئِذٍ دُونَ الْمُحْتَلِمِ "
وسنده حسن
Al-Hussein went to Omar while he was given a sermon over the minbar (pulpit) of the Messenger of Allah (peace be upon him) on the day of Jumu'ah. He (Al-Hussein) said: "Come down from the minbar of my
Grandfather". Omar said: "Wait a second, o son of my brother (Rasulullah)." Al-Hussein then grabbed Omar's garment and repeated what he said until Omar stopped his Khutbah (speech) and descended the minbar (pulpit) and finished his prayer. Once Omar finished his prayer he asked for Al-Hussein, once he (Al-Hussein) arrive he (Omar) asked him: "Who told you to do this?" Al-Hussein answered: Nobody ordered me to do so." Al-Hussein repeated that three times. [...] At this time Al-Hussein did not reach puperty (i.e. he was a child).
In any case, even if he meant his own father, he was a child, he only saw his family (Rasulullah, who passed away) ascending the Minbar, Ali himself (as per his OWN testimony) never taught Al-Hussein to say such thing nor to believe that Omar is an usurper as proven by a narration earlier where Ali even wanted to punish his son for what he said!. Also if they were enemies what would they be doing listening to Omar's Khutbah's in the first place? "Exposing Omar"?! If so, why didn't Ali himself say what his sons said?!
He (Al-Hussein) was used since childhood to see his (grand)father Rasulullah (peace be upon him) on the pulpit, nobody ever ascended the pulpit except Rasulullah (peace be upon him) then for a quite short time Abu Bakr (who only ruled two years) then Omar (who ruled over 11 years). Al-Hussein (and in other narrations Al-Hassan to Abu Bakr) were still kids and they said what children say when they believe something belongs to their father/mother/grandfather etc. only, they never meant to insult Omar or to accuse him of being an usurper or anything of that sort. If anyone should have done this, then their father and not a little kid, but obviously there is no such narration (of Ali saying get off the minbar of Rasulullah or my own minbar) because Ali never believed that Abu Bakr or Omar were usurpers in the first place.
3)
As mentioned before, children are very protective by nature. Fact is, neither Al-Hassan nor Al-Hassan ever repeated such statements later on, let alone in their adulthood. The honest truth-seeker will quickly realise that there are no such narrations and statements in regards to Othman Ibn Affan, although he too is regarded as a usurper and tyrant according to the Twelver Shias and thus must have also received the same message from Al-Hussein. Of course neither Al-Hassan nor Al-Hussein ever said such a thing to the third rightly guided Khalifa and the reason is quite obvious: Al-Hassan and Al-Hussein were adults by the time Othman ruled, they never repeated things children (like themselves during Omar's rule) say (and Shias use as a Hujjah/argument!). In fact as Sahih narrations testify, it was Ali Ibn Abi Talib who ordered them to protect Othman with their own lifes against the rebels who wanted to kill him. But of course, such narrations that prove the love between the Ahl Al-Bayt and Sahabah will be either omitted by the Shias or watered down as watery as possible ...
4)
As mentioned ealrier, Al-Hussein (nor his brother) ever repeated such statements again. Omar ruled for over 11 years, ALL the Bani Hashim, including Ali Ibn Abi Talib and his sons always prayed behind him (there is not a single authentic reference suggesting otherwise) and according to rock-solid-sahih narrations (which the biased Rafidah do not mention in their quest of hatred and takfir) Ali prayed for Omar, even at his funeral, wishing him nothing but the best. Al-Hassan and Al-Hussein grew into adults during the long rule of Omar and they met him and had nothing but respect and love for him (and so did he), he used to visit and join the gatherings of Omar, in fact in another version of the narration, Al-Hussein adds another incident which beautifuly illustrates what a love and respect Omar had for Al-Hussein:
، حدثني : الحسين بن علي ، قال : أتيت على عمر بن الخطاب وهو على المنبر فصعدت إليه ، فقلت : أنزل ، عن منبر أبي وإذهب إلى منبر أبيك ، فقال عمر : لم يكن لأبي منبر وأخذني وأجلسني معه فجعلت أقلب خنصر يدي ، فلما نزل إنطلق بي إلى منزله ، فقال لي : من علمك ، فقلت : والله ما علمنيه أحد ، قال : يا بني لو جعلت تغشانا ، قال : فأتيته يوماً وهو خال بمعاوية وأبن عمر بالباب فرجع إبن عمر ورجعت معه فلقيني بعد ، فقال : بم أرك ، فقلت : يا أمير المؤمنين أني جئت وأنت خال بمعاوية وأبن عمر بالباب فرجع بن عمر ورجعت معه ، فقال : أنت أحق بالإذن من بن عمر وإنما إنبت ما ترى في رؤوسنا الله ، ثم أنتم.
الخطيب البغدادي - تاريخ بغداد - الجزء : ( 1 ) - رقم الصفحة : 151
[...] Oِn the authority of Al-Hussein [Ibn Ali Ibn Abi Talib] who said:
I went to Omar while he was given a sermon over the minbar (pulpit). I ascended to him and said: "Come down from the minbar of my father, and go to the minbar of your father!". Omar answered: "My father had no pulpit".
At this time Omar got down from the minbar, and sat me on the minbar beside him and played with my little (pinky) fingerand while he was descending he said: "O my son! Who taught you this?" I (Al-Hussein) said: "By Allah, nobody taught me this." He (Omar) said: "O my son, [...] He (Al-Hussein) said: "On another day I went to Omar and while he was busy with Mu'awiyah and Ibn Omar (son of Omar) standing at the door, so me and Ibn Omar left together. Omar met me later and asked: "Why you didn’t come?" Al-Hussein said: "
O Chief of the Believers! When I came to meet you, I saw you were busy with Mu'awiyah and Ibn 'Omar was already standing at the door (waiting to talk to his father), eventually Ibn 'Omar left and I left with him.
Upon hearing this Omar said: "You are more worthy of having the permission of seeing me than Ibn Omar and is there anyone else besides Allah and then you (Rasulullah and Ahl Al-Bayt) who have honoured us!" [Al-Khatib Al-Baghdadi, Tarikh Baghdad, vol. 1, p. 151]
Ask yourself. Is this how a Nasibi talks and treats the Ahl Al-Bayt? And is this how the son of Fatimah shall socialise with the (as per sick and twisted Shia narrative) murderer of his mother+unborn brother?!? Can you by now tell how the Shia religion is the real takfiri school of thought, managing of even turning a beautiful narration and the one we are discussing here into a battlefield of hatred between the Sahabah and Ahl Al-Bayt? Is it not sad how millions of Shias have been misguided and pumped with hatred by the Shia scholars?
As a matter of act, Islamic history as a whole (not picking and chosing random and cut in pieces narrations that champion ones narrative of anconstant hate battle between the Sahaba and Ahl Al-Bayt) provides the non-biased researcher with evidence that
Omar did not just love the Ahl Al-Bayt, but in fact preferred them over himself and his own children as you have just read and there are many such narrations which completely destroy the entire Shia religion that is based on the narrative that there was hatred and murder between the Ahl Al-Bayt and Omar Ibn Al-Khattab in particular. I stronly advise everyone to study the following well written article proving how 'Omar always respected and loved the Ahl Al-Bayt over everyone else:
https://youpuncturedtheark.wordpress.com/2011/03/29/part-6-nature-of-relationship-between-ahlebaytra-and-umarra/And in this article another interesting fact has been analysed, namely that Omar did not just do lip service when it came to the Ahl Al-Bayt, but he preferred them under all circumstances and made them wealthy land owners (!):
http://twelvershia.net/2013/06/02/umar-ra-returned-to-ali-ra-the-lands-and-gave-him-new-ones/That's after all what Nasibis do ... playing gently with a pinky finger Al-Hassan, giving space on the pulpit for Fatimah's son, preferring them over their own sons and finally making them landlord! How historical facts that are unkown to most Shias simply destroy the religion and narrative of the Shias ...CONCLUSION:
This story and narration in no way proves that Al-Hussein hated Omar or challenged his Caliphate. In fact (if the Shias would stop cutting and omitting what they dislike) this narrations proves how much love and respect Omar had for the Ahl Al-Bayt, to an extent that he preferred the sons of Ali and Fatimah (may Allah be pleased with them) over his very own children. This is why we Muslims, we the Ahl Al-Sunnah actually teach these narrations to our children, raising them with the love for the Ahl Al-Bayt and the Sahabah, whereas the Rafidah have managed to even misuse such a narration as the one being discussed to add fuel to the fire of Rafd (rejectionism) ...
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October 14, 2015, 11:51:34 AM