Reply,
“Ali and Abbas knew”,
Are you telling me that they knew what the Prophet (pbuh) had said about inheritance concerning him but they disregarded it???If one would say something about this concerning Hazrath Abu Bakar (ra) then, this results in “takfeer” according to you, but not when it comes to other companions, why???
No, they went to see whatever it is that they could get a hold of, whether Khums or lands of Fay' as is apparent from the texts, especially since they explicitly said they heard these words from the Prophet's (saw) mouth.
Unless you're accusing `Ali and `Abbas of being liars who claimed to hear the Prophet (saw) say something he never said so they may take Fatimah's (as) right and split it between them OR that they are disobedient greedy sinners who disregarded the Prophet's (saw) words to get their hands on the money.
1, Hazrath Fatimah (sa) is not aware of the issue and matter, and those who are strangers compared to her relationship with the Prophet (pbuh), was told about it and were made aware of such an important issue and matter. This goes against sense and logic and what is natural and common behaviour and practice.
She never asked and she wasn't told, because dividing the inheritance is not her job rather it is up to the men and those in charge. Abu Bakr was the one in charge and he knew thus he explained things to her and also `Ali was her husband and he knew so he never returned Fadak to Fatimah's (as) children even after he became in charge nor did he claim it.
Women had no part in this...
I add, there's a lot of other things she never knew such as when Ahlul-Bayt wondered where they were going to bury the Prophet (saw), Abu Bakr was the one who informed them of the Hadith stating that prophets are buried wherever they die, they believed him and did just that.
you said,
“or she was told but she didn’t accept it”,
2, It depends what you mean here. If you mean that she was told by the Messenger (pbuh) but still didn’t accept it, if this is what you mean then, this should also result in takfeer according to your belief and faith. If something as such was said about Hazrath Abu Bakar (ra) that would result in takfeer then, I’m sure the same can and should apply about Hazrath Fatimah (sa).
What's up with you guys and Takfeer? Is it a hobby?
No, I meant: Maybe she was told by her husband or a relative, but she was surprised and thought they misunderstood, then when she went to Abu Bakr he gave her the same answer.
You said,
“As for Fatimah (as), there was no benefit in telling her in the first place since women have no say in matters of inheritance nor in how it is divided.”
Now this is the talk of the time of jahiliya. Is this how women are viewed and looked at in Islam about their rights??? If this is true what you have said and let me point it out again,
Women are also not required to give Bay`ah, they can't marry unless with permission of their Wali, and two women witnesses are equal to one man. If you don't like it go join atheistic feminist groups.
you said'
“since women have no say in matters of inheritance nor in how it is divided"
then could you prove this from the Quran and Sunnah please???
In their society, the heads of the family who were men are in charge of all of this, not the women. Read about their society before you ask random question.
You said,
“Abu Bakr knowing makes a lot more sense as the Prophet (saw) knew he'd be in authority and he would be in charge of what he (saw) left behind”,
This is a different matter brother which I completely disagree with. The Prophet (pbuh) didn’t leave anything behind a part from two things: 1, Holy Quran and 2, Ahlul Baith. He only left two things behind for the Ummah and the Ummah consists of the companions as well. The companions are the Ummah and are an important part of it. He told the Ummah to hold on to these two things and not to separate them. But we all know what happened after his death.
Great, if he only left behind these two things (Qur'an & Ahlul-Bayt) then there was no land called "Fadak" which he left behind.
Problem solved.
(Note: Your highlighted statement is incorrect and this is not mentioned anywhere in any Hadith.)
You said,
“She may also not have asked her father out of shyness as asking about such material possessions may be considered rude as if she is waiting for his death to take his money and she was not like this",
If she may not have asked then the Prophet (pbuh) didn’t say anything either??? Well she didn’t have to ask since inheritance is inheritance and everyone inherits. Now if it’s different when it comes to Prophets and Messengers or it was different concerning this Prophet (pbuh) then, this difference should have been put forward
and made clear. I go with sense and logic and you’re not making any sense at all.
There is no need to ask as laws of inheritance are generally written the Book of Allah. He (saw) also didn't find a need to tell her anything since he told other men who are in charge of her and they are the ones who divide the shares.
and you said,
“they use it to make TAKFEER ON ABU BAKAR”,
Excuse me??? How can you make TAkFEER ON ABU BAKAR??? Hazrath Abu Bakar (ra) is not part of religion but a member of religion. “TAKFEER ON ABAU BAKAR “ this is exactly what extremism is all about.
Well then you're the only Shia on planet earth who doesn't consider Abu Bakr a Kafir. Try convincing your scholars and laypeople then come preach to us about tolerance and extremism.
You said,
“If it weren’t for Fadak, Fatimah (sa) has almost no role in Imami Tashayyu”,
Absolute rubbish and utter nonsense! Don’t go about assuming and then accusing. This is all you seem to do. Read and learn about others rather than chasing your own assumptions.
I'm sure as a Shia you'll agree that most of the time Shia mention Fatimah (as) is to talk about how she was oppressed and how they took Fadak away from her. Dude it's all over the Shia websites, it's almost impossible to find a biography of her not containing a huge part about Fadak.
Look at this Shia book about the fourteen infallible ones, it's called "The Fourteen Luminaries of Islam" by: Ahmad Ahmadi Birjandi and is found
here.
Look at the section on Fatimah (as) in this book, it discusses five topics: Her parents, her life, her marriage, her sorrow and sadness and finally Fadak.
Section on her parents barely contains anything about her. Section on her life is only 4 very tiny paragraphs. Section on marriage is slightly bigger. Then the rest of the article which is 65%, is all about her sadness and grief and Fadak. In fact the biggest section is on Fadak and it alone is near 50% of the entire biography.
“What is mentioned in Allah's book is general inheritance as it involves all people and is a matter which concerns them. What prophets do with their material possessions concerns no one but prophets nor does it affect anyone's lives nor is it from Usoul”,
What Prophets do is demonstrate the shariath they bring about through practical means in the form of actions because shariath also applies to them. And what ever they own belongs to their children and wives. If there is a separate law on this then it should have been in the Quran otherwise what is normal and comes natural through shariath applies.
Not necessarily, because all Muslims agree that Banu Hashim cannot receive Sadaqah, yet this is not in the Qur'an. This is even more important than inheritance because it affects us as well at least since we may give them Sadaqah by mistake.
The Prophet (saw) explained laws of inheritance and they are clear in the Qur'an, his did his job perfectly. What does it affect me if Prophets do not leave inheritance? It affects no one nor does it change anything in religion.
Unless you believe everything is in the Qur'an and there is absolutely nothing left in the Sunnah that isn't contained in the Qur'an.
You said,
“As for Abu Bakr he followed the way of the Prophet (saw) generally concerning the lands, he specifically says in the narration that he won't change the way the Prophet (saw) used it and that Aal-Muhammad can eat from it",
Did Hazrath Abu Bakar (ra) follow the way of the Prophet (pbuh) or did he make a few changes according to his understanding, we shall discuss this Insha’allah. But Aal e Muhammad (pbuh) can’t inherit but can have a share of the income generated from it??? Can eat from it???
As long as he followed his way for the most part, no harm.
You said,
“You just accused the guy of stealing right there, and also lying in religion",
If I accused the guy of stealing then stealing is wrong and is a sin but how does this make me a Kafir and how is this takfeer??? How have I lied in religion??? Since when did Hazrath Abu Baks (ra) become religion or part of religion??? This is extreme my friend and this is exactly what extremism is all about and where it comes from. Assuming that a companion is religion or part of religion is kufar itself.
I didn't say you're a Kafir, I said you accused him of Kufr and lying in religion which leads a person to dwell in hellfire.
You said,
“ Do humans not forget things and aren't they ignorant of a lot of things?",
Was Hazrath Abu Bakar (ra) not human too??? And can’t ignorance also apply to him??? Why is it that if anyone comes along and says and believes in something that goes against Hazrath Abu Bakar (ra) but this applies to TAKFEER but when it comes to Hazrath Fatimah (sa) then, you seem to come back down to earth and you suddenly realise that she was human after all???
Abu Bakr can make mistakes but he narrated a clear Hadith and everyone agreed with him. Fatimah (as) never narrated anything she was ignorant of the matter. It's unlikely that Abu Bakr had a dream and in his dream he heard this Hadith and woke up in the morning thinking the Prophet (saw) said this, then several other companions had the same dream and they were all mistaken but Fatimah (as) was correct.
It is much clearer and more logical if they knew what she did not know, end of story.
You said,
“Or maybe you believe Fatimah is a godly being such as Khomayni does?",
This is what you seem to believe about Hazrath Abu Bakar (ra). Anything that goes against him results in TAKFEER and an ATTACK ON RELIGION!
Ah so you say we also believe Abu Bakr is godly?
I say: You're the one who believes Fatimah (as) is a goddess in human form.
Only one of us isn't saying the truth and there is a very simple way of finding out,
so I challenge you in front of everyone to bring me one quotation from your own books regarding Fatimah (as) where she has committed a mistake or a sin.
In return I can give you a quotation from our books where I show you that Abu Bakr committed a mistake or sin.
The one who cannot bring forth this evidence is the untruthful one.