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Sunni Shia Discussion Forum => Sahabah-AhlulBayt => Topic started by: أبو ماريا المرزم on December 25, 2015, 08:27:50 AM

Title: Umar Ibn Al Khattab Ra and Hunain
Post by: أبو ماريا المرزم on December 25, 2015, 08:27:50 AM

I often come across rafidah who slander Amir Ul Mu'mineen Ra, regarding what Hunain. I already know the lies tht he fled Uhud have been debunked, but I've seen radidah quote this hadeeth 

Narrated Abu Qatada: We set out in the company of Allah’s Apostle on the day (of the battle) of Hunain. When we faced the enemy, the Muslims retreated and I saw a pagan throwing himself over a Muslim. I turned around and came upon him from behind and hit him on the shoulder with the sword He (i.e. the pagan) came towards me and seized me so violently that I felt as if it were death itself, but death overtook him and he released me. I followed ‘Umar bin Al Khattab and asked (him), “What is wrong with the people(fleeing)?” He replied, “This is the Will of Allah,” After the people returned, the Prophet sat and said, “Anyone who has killed an enemy and has a proof of that, will posses his spoils.” [Sahih al-Bukhari, Book 53, Hadith 370]

Title: Re: Umar Ibn Al Khattab Ra and Hunain
Post by: Abubakar on December 25, 2015, 07:46:59 PM

Salam

Check the refutation here :
https://islamistruth.wordpress.com/2011/08/20/did-umarra-ran-away-from-battle-of-hunain/

Title: Re: Umar Ibn Al Khattab Ra and Hunain
Post by: Rationalist on December 26, 2015, 08:35:29 PM

Quote from: أبو ماريا المرزم on December 25, 2015, 08:27:50 AM

 

Narrated Abu Qatada: We set out in the company of Allah’s Apostle on the day (of the battle) of Hunain. When we faced the enemy, the Muslims retreated and I saw a pagan throwing himself over a Muslim. I turned around and came upon him from behind and hit him on the shoulder with the sword He (i.e. the pagan) came towards me and seized me so violently that I felt as if it were death itself, but death overtook him and he released me. I followed ‘Umar bin Al Khattab and asked (him), “What is wrong with the people(fleeing)?” He replied, “This is the Will of Allah,” After the people returned, the Prophet sat and said, “Anyone who has killed an enemy and has a proof of that, will posses his spoils.” [Sahih al-Bukhari, Book 53, Hadith 370]

Abu Qatada is one of the pro Ali sahaba. He supported Imam Ali (as) in Jamal and Siffin, while some of the companions like Abu Said Khudri who the dozeners list a true sahaba did not support Ali in those battles.

Title: Re: Umar Ibn Al Khattab Ra and Hunain
Post by: Farid on December 26, 2015, 11:50:41 PM

Are you sure that he was in Jamal and Siffeen?

Title: Re: Umar Ibn Al Khattab Ra and Hunain
Post by: Rationalist on December 27, 2015, 01:03:57 AM

Unless there is another Abu Qatada ibn Rab'i.

Title: Re: Umar Ibn Al Khattab Ra and Hunain
Post by: Farid on December 27, 2015, 01:24:26 AM

I would still like a source.

Title: Re: Umar Ibn Al Khattab Ra and Hunain
Post by: Rationalist on December 27, 2015, 01:48:35 AM

I don't have one right now, but on the 12er Shia websites of history he listed with a major role which is a general of Imam Ali's army.

http://www.al-islam.org/restatement-history-islam-and-muslims-sayyid-ali-ashgar-razwy/battle-basra-battle-camel

Title: Re: Umar Ibn Al Khattab Ra and Hunain
Post by: Farid on December 27, 2015, 02:00:27 AM

I do not accept that as a source. I am only doubting this because the sahaba barely took part in Al Jamal and Siffeen.

Excuse me for derailing the topic guys.

Title: Re: Umar Ibn Al Khattab Ra and Hunain
Post by: Rationalist on December 27, 2015, 07:48:53 AM

Inshallah will do more research. But against the Dozeners it shows that Umar can't be monafiq regardless of their interpretation of this ahadith.

Title: Re: Umar Ibn Al Khattab Ra and Hunain
Post by: أبو ماريا المرزم on December 28, 2015, 01:52:49 AM

Why so?

Title: Re: Umar Ibn Al Khattab Ra and Hunain
Post by: Rationalist on December 28, 2015, 07:45:54 AM

The reason is if we go by the 12er Shia understanding of this ahadith which again is false then Abu Qathada ran away too. Then the same Imam Ali (as) appointed Abu Qathada as a general who the 12ers consider a coward?