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What is the system of government in Islam? Question to Sunnis/Wahabis

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al-Habib

Re: What is the system of government in Islam? Question to Sunnis/Wahabis
« Reply #60 on: August 28, 2016, 12:30:25 AM »
The machine gun tactic is where you quote a multitude of narrations/arguments at the same time and expect someone to bother to respond to each and every one of them.  It's like opening a box of insects, each of them is puny but you hope that their number can overwhelm the enemy.  It doesn't show intelligence on your part, just your ignorance on how debating works.

I could respond to any, but I will choose to defend the mothers of the believers.  In reality, this should be a separate thread on it's own, but let's just end this here and you respond to this in another thread:


Sahih Muslims 1474: 'A'isha (Allah be pleased with her) reported Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) liked sweet (dish) and honey. After saying the afternoon prayer he used to visit his wives going close to them. So he went to Hafsa and stayed with her more than what was his usual stay. I ('A'isha) asked about that. It was said to me: A woman of her family had sent her a small vessel of honey as gift, and she gave to the messenger of Allah s.w. from that a drink. I said: By allah we will lie to him.

حَدَّثَنَا أَبُو كُرَيْبٍ، مُحَمَّدُ بْنُ الْعَلاَءِ وَهَارُونُ بْنُ عَبْدِ اللَّهِ قَالاَ حَدَّثَنَا أَبُو أُسَامَةَ، عَنْ هِشَامٍ، عَنْ أَبِيهِ، عَنْ عَائِشَةَ، قَالَتْ كَانَ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم يُحِبُّ الْحَلْوَاءَ وَالْعَسَلَ فَكَانَ إِذَا صَلَّى الْعَصْرَ دَارَ عَلَى نِسَائِهِ فَيَدْنُو مِنْهُنَّ فَدَخَلَ عَلَى حَفْصَةَ فَاحْتَبَسَ عِنْدَهَا أَكْثَرَ مِمَّا كَانَ يَحْتَبِسُ فَسَأَلْتُ عَنْ ذَلِكَ فَقِيلَ لِي أَهْدَتْ لَهَا امْرَأَةٌ مِنْ قَوْمِهَا عُكَّةً مِنْ عَسَلٍ فَسَقَتْ رَسُولَ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم مِنْهُ شَرْبَةً فَقُلْتُ أَمَا وَاللَّهِ لَنَحْتَالَنَّ لَهُ

The prophet s.a.a.w.w. said: Sahih bukhari 1291: I heard the Prophet (ﷺ) saying, "Ascribing false things to me is not like ascribing false things to anyone else. Whosoever tells a lie against me intentionally then surely let him occupy his seat in Hell-Fire."
دَّثَنَا أَبُو نُعَيْمٍ، حَدَّثَنَا سَعِيدُ بْنُ عُبَيْدٍ، عَنْ عَلِيِّ بْنِ رَبِيعَةَ، عَنِ الْمُغِيرَةِ ـ رضى الله عنه ـ قَالَ سَمِعْتُ النَّبِيَّ صلى الله عليه وسلم يَقُولُ ‏"‏ إِنَّ كَذِبًا عَلَىَّ لَيْسَ كَكَذِبٍ عَلَى أَحَدٍ، مَنْ كَذَبَ عَلَىَّ مُتَعَمِّدًا فَلْيَتَبَوَّأْ مَقْعَدَهُ مِنَ النَّارِ
You think that’s bad? It gets worse just wait for it. These Ayat came down on Aisha and Hafsa because of their honey and lying incident. At’tahrim 4: If you two [wives] repent to Allah , [it is best], for your hearts have deviated. But if you cooperate against him - then indeed Allah is his protector, and Gabriel and the righteous of the believers and the angels, moreover, are [his] assistants.Perhaps his Lord, if he divorced you, would substitute for him wives better than you - submitting [to Allah ], believing, devoutly obedient, repentant, worshipping, and traveling - [ones] previously married and virgins.
بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم
إِن تَتُوبَا إِلَى اللَّهِ فَقَدْ صَغَتْ قُلُوبُكُمَا وَإِن تَظَاهَرَا عَلَيْهِ فَإِنَّ اللَّهَ هُوَ مَوْلَاهُ وَجِبْرِيلُ وَصَالِحُ الْمُؤْمِنِينَ وَالْمَلَائِكَةُ بَعْدَ ذَلِكَ ظَهِيرٌ ﴿4﴾ عَسَى رَبُّهُ إِن طَلَّقَكُنَّ أَن يُبْدِلَهُ أَزْوَاجًا خَيْرًا مِّنكُنَّ مُسْلِمَاتٍ مُّؤْمِنَاتٍ قَانِتَاتٍ تَائِبَاتٍ عَابِدَاتٍ سَائِحَاتٍ ثَيِّبَاتٍ وَأَبْكَارًا
صدق الله العلي العظيم

WHICH MEANS THAT AISHA AND HAFSA ARE THE OPPOSITE OF EXACTLY EVERY ATTRIBUTE ALLAH MENTIONED!!!!!!! You don’t think the hadith is about them? Let’s go to bukhari again. Sahih bukhari 5267: I heard `Aisha saying, "The Prophet (ﷺ) used to stay for a long while with Zanab bint Jahsh and drink honey at her house. So Hafsa and I decided that if the Prophet (ﷺ) came to anyone of us, she should say him, "I detect the smell of Maghafir (bad smell) in you. Have you eaten Maghafir?' " So the Prophet (ﷺ) visited one of them and she said to him similarly. The Prophet (ﷺ) said, "Never mind, I have taken some honey at the house of Zainab bint Jahsh, but I shall never drink of it anymore." So there was revealed: 'O Prophet ! Why do you ban (for you) that which Allah has made lawful for you . . . If you two (wives of Prophet) turn in repentance to Allah,' (66.1-4) addressing Aisha and Hafsa. 'When the Prophet (ﷺ) disclosed a matter in confidence to some of his wives.' (66.3) namely his saying: But I have taken some honey."

You've cited a narration (sahih) from Bukhari that mentions the incident where the two wives conspired against the Prophet (ﷺ).  This was a mistake on their part.  But you are mistaken in connecting it with the hadith that says that whoever attributes false things to the Prophet (ﷺ) is in hell.  To attribute something to his is to say "Muhammad (ﷺ) said this or did that" and he didn't.  That is what the hadith is referring to.  It encourages the women TO REPENT!  Unlike with Abu Lahab it instantly says he and his wife are in hell. 

And the verse doesn't mean that those attributes are opposite of what Aisha and Hafsah are.  First off it says "'3asaa" which means "it could be" ya3ni if you keep misbehaving you will be replaced..  These verses are in WARNING, not condemnation.  Next it says that Muhammad (ﷺ) could given in replacement with "thayibaat and abkaara" which means previously-married women and virgins.  Hafsa was Thayibah and Aisha was abkaar so that refutes the fact that the attributes mean that they are opposite. 

I encourage you to read the rest of the Surah, you seem to be interested in learning the Qur'an.  Toward the end it says:
ضَرَبَ اللَّـهُ مَثَلًا لِّلَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا امْرَأَتَ نُوحٍ وَامْرَأَتَ لُوطٍ ۖ كَانَتَا تَحْتَ عَبْدَيْنِ مِنْ عِبَادِنَا صَالِحَيْنِ فَخَانَتَاهُمَا فَلَمْ يُغْنِيَا عَنْهُمَا مِنَ اللَّـهِ شَيْئًا وَقِيلَ ادْخُلَا النَّارَ مَعَ الدَّاخِلِينَ
Allah presents an example of those who disbelieved: the wife of Noah and the wife of Lot. They were under two of Our righteous servants but betrayed them, so those prophets did not avail them from Allah at all, and it was said, "Enter the Fire with those who enter." (66:10).

This is a warning to them of what could happen lest they continue to misbehave.  Then it says:

وَضَرَبَ اللَّـهُ مَثَلًا لِّلَّذِينَ آمَنُوا امْرَأَتَ فِرْعَوْنَ إِذْ قَالَتْ رَبِّ ابْنِ لِي عِندَكَ بَيْتًا فِي الْجَنَّةِ وَنَجِّنِي مِن فِرْعَوْنَ وَعَمَلِهِ وَنَجِّنِي مِنَ الْقَوْمِ الظَّالِمِينَ
And Allah presents an example of those who believed: the wife of Pharaoh, when she said, "My Lord, build for me near You a house in Paradise and save me from Pharaoh and his deeds and save me from the wrongdoing people." (66:11)
 وَمَرْيَمَ ابْنَتَ عِمْرَانَ الَّتِي أَحْصَنَتْ فَرْجَهَا فَنَفَخْنَا فِيهِ مِن رُّوحِنَا وَصَدَّقَتْ بِكَلِمَاتِ رَبِّهَا وَكُتُبِهِ وَكَانَتْ مِنَ الْقَانِتِينَ
And [the example of] Mary, the daughter of 'Imran, who guarded her chastity, so We blew into [her garment] through Our angel, and she believed in the words of her Lord and His scriptures and was of the devoutly obedient. (66:12).

Now these are encouragements with examples for them to look up to.  Women of honor in the countenance of Allah.   

al-Habib

Re: What is the system of government in Islam? Question to Sunnis/Wahabis
« Reply #61 on: August 28, 2016, 12:49:36 AM »
So are Aishah and Hafsa not thayibat?  I want you to answer this..

al-Habib

Re: What is the system of government in Islam? Question to Sunnis/Wahabis
« Reply #62 on: August 28, 2016, 01:02:02 AM »
No.  I mean THAYIBAT.  with a "th".  Do you know what it means?

al-Habib

Re: What is the system of government in Islam? Question to Sunnis/Wahabis
« Reply #63 on: August 28, 2016, 01:03:53 AM »
It's in the ayah.

al-Habib

Re: What is the system of government in Islam? Question to Sunnis/Wahabis
« Reply #64 on: August 28, 2016, 01:34:34 AM »
Allow me to reiterate:  You cannot say that Hafsah and Aishah are opposite to the attributes listed since the two terms "thayibah" and "abkaar" (previously married women or virgin respectively) are included.  Those terms are literally applicable to them since Hafsa was a widow before her marriage and Aisha was a virgin.  The ayah means that Allah could replace them with better if need be.  With either previously married women or virgins.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2016, 01:35:43 AM by al-Habib »

 

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