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Sunni imam about Jaafar Al-Sadiq

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al-kulayni

Sunni imam about Jaafar Al-Sadiq
« on: December 10, 2015, 05:13:38 PM »
Assalamu aleykum,

What can we answer to this
Quote
Ibn Habban about Imam Musa al-Kadhim [as]

يحتج بروايته ما كان من غير رواية أولاده عنه، لأن في حديث ولده عنه مناكير كثيرة.
"His narration is reliable as long as it has been narrated from other than his children, because the reports of his children from him are very much 'Munkar'."
Al-Thuqat, Volume 6 page 131 Translation No. 7039


"Munkar is what has been narrated by a weak narrator"
We further read:
فمَنْ فَحُشَ غَلَطُهُ ، أَو كَثُرَتْ غَفلَتُه ، أَو ظهَرَ فِسْقُه ؛ فحديثُهُ مُنْكَرٍ .
"One whose mistakes are abysmal or his negligence is massive or has showed immorality, his hadith is Munkar"
[www.almeshkat.com]

Yahya bin Saeed about Imam Jafar [as]
ى بن سعيد : مجالد أحب إلى منه ، في نفسي منه شئ

Yahya bin Saeed said: 'Mujalid is more beloved to me than him (Jafar), there is something in my feelings against him (Jafar).'
Mizan al Eitdal, Volume 1 No. 1519

Apart from being narrator of all six principle books of Ahle Sunnah, let us introduce and enlighten our readers about the exalted position Imam Yahya bin Saeed enjoys amongst Ahle Sunnah. Imam Ibn Hajar Asqalani records:

Yahya bin Saeed bin Furukh al-Qatan al-Tamimi Abu Saeed al-Basry al-Ahwal al-Hafiz…Al-Saji narrated from Ali bin al-Madini said: 'I never saw some one more knowledgeable than Yahya bin al-Qatan in rijal'… Ahmad bin Yahya bin al-Jarood narrated from ibn al-Madini saying: 'I never saw someone who is more Thabt than Yahya al-Qatan'. Ibrahim said: 'I never saw someone who was more knowledgeable than Yahya al-qatan in rijal'. Abudllah bin Ahmad said: 'I heard my father saying: 'My eyes never saw someone who is similar to him''…Al-Fadhel bin Zyad said: 'I heard Ahmad saying by Allah we never met someone who was similar to him'. Ibn al-Mahdi said: 'Your eyes can never see someone who is similar to him'…Ibn Khuzayma narrated that Bendar said: 'Yahya bin Saeed is the imam of his time'…(Ibn Ammar said): 'If he talked, the jurist kept listening to him'…(Bendar said): 'I think he never disobeyed Allah'… Abu Dawoud narrated from Yahya ibn Mueen that he said: 'Yahya al-Qatan used to recite (and complete) Quran every night for twenty years and he never missed performing down prayers at the mosque for forty years'. Ibn Sa'ad said: 'He was thiqa, secure, exalted, proof (Hujah)'. Al-Ejli said: 'He is Basri, thiqah in hadith, he used to narrate from the thiqa narrators only'. Abu Zua'ra said: 'He was one of the thiqah and hafiz'. Abu Hatim said: 'Proof (huja) and hafiz'. Al-Nesa'i said: 'Thiqah, Thabt and satisfactory'… Ibn Manjweh said: 'He was one of the masters of his time, he was hafiz, devoted, knowledgeable, pious, religious and ideal'…Al-Khalili said: 'No doubt he is an Imam and he is the greatest companion of Malik at Basrah'.
Tahdeeb al Tahdeeb, Volume 11 No. 359

In the very biography recorded by Imam Ibn Hajar Asqalani, we read an interesting aspect of the life of Yahya bin Saeed:

"His grand son said: 'My grand father never used to joke or laugh and he never entered a bathroom"


Imam Malik about Imam Jafar Sadiq [as]

Imam Dhahabi in his famed work Meezan al-Eitidal, Volume 1 No. 1519 records the view of Imam Malik about Imam Jafar Sadiq [as] in this manner:

"Musa'ab ibn Abdullah said: 'Malik would not narrate from Jafar until he linked it with those narrators who are high, then he would put his (Jafar's) narration after it"

which means Malik did not trust Imam Jafar Sadiq's narration unless someone else narrated the same!



Imam Bukhari about Imam Jafar Sadiq [as]

Imam Bukhari had doubts on the veracity of Imam Jafar Sadiq [as]. Ibn Tamiyah records in Minhaj al-Sunnah, Volume 7 page 390:
قد استراب البخاري في بعض حديثه لما بلغه عن يحيى بن سعيد القطان فيه كلام فلم يخرج له
Bukhari had doubts over him (Jafar) due to the criticism levelled at him (Jafar) by Yahya bin Saeed al-Qattan"

Hani

Re: Sunni imam about Jaafar Al-Sadiq
« Reply #1 on: December 10, 2015, 11:12:15 PM »
First of all the books are full of praise for Ja`far, so the majority praised him big time.

But I have a question,

The scholars of Hadith really took great care from who they narrated from.

Based on this and on the fact that the Shia attributed many lies to Ja`far, can they not be suspicious of the man?

Logically they can be suspicious due to the large amount of lies attributed to his name. Still almost everybody narrated from him and his Hadith can be found in the books of most authors including Bukhari and Malik.

I add, it's also not impossible that he'd simply be a Saduq whose Hadith is good but not as great as that of a Thiqah. That goes back to his specialization, the number of his teachers, his memory etc... Nothing personal.

« Last Edit: December 10, 2015, 11:14:09 PM by Hani »
عَلامَةُ أَهْلِ الْبِدَعِ الْوَقِيعَةُ فِي أَهْلِ الأَثَرِ. وَعَلامَةُ الْجَهْمِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُشَبِّهَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الْقَدَرِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُجَبِّرَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الزَّنَادِقَةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ الأَثَرِ حَشْوِيَّةً

Religion = simple & clear

scusemyenglish

Re: Sunni imam about Jaafar Al-Sadiq
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2016, 02:18:34 PM »
Hello ,

In this video there is  shia who says Jaafar sadiq know law of gravity. botanical. He was wreating treaty of science...

Do you know if it's true?

or, If we have the same information in sunni view?

Baraka la ou fik it's important because I want to show that Abou Hourayra has most "konwledge" about "EL GHAYB" that shia. 

About Jaafar it's true or it's hadith not clear whith they give scientific interpretations like the hadith of Abou Hourayra on "fire in hijaz" when Shia says this fire is linked with the war against Houty in Yemen...

Barakala ou fik.

Look it's here...

Abou Hourayra narrated that the messenger saws said:

"“There will come to the people years
of treachery (...) the Ruwaibidhah will decide matters.”
It was said

 'Who are the Ruwaibidhah?'

The Prophet replied:

 “Vile and
ignorant men who will speak in the affairs of the people.”

Hani

Re: Sunni imam about Jaafar Al-Sadiq
« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2016, 09:56:18 PM »
I can show you an authentic Shia Hadith from al-Kafi where Ja`far says something (related to space and wheather) that is so scientifically inaccurate that it's laughable.
عَلامَةُ أَهْلِ الْبِدَعِ الْوَقِيعَةُ فِي أَهْلِ الأَثَرِ. وَعَلامَةُ الْجَهْمِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُشَبِّهَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الْقَدَرِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُجَبِّرَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الزَّنَادِقَةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ الأَثَرِ حَشْوِيَّةً

Religion = simple & clear

Bolani Muslim

Re: Sunni imam about Jaafar Al-Sadiq
« Reply #4 on: January 28, 2016, 10:28:50 PM »
Like 'Taha Syed' said, many of these 'miracle books' were forgeries made in the 1500 and 1600s (coincidentally when Shiaism became the state religion of Iran). I know in Hayat al-Quloob, their is a hadis saying that black people were made as a punishment and to be the slaves of white people.

Hadrami

Re: Sunni imam about Jaafar Al-Sadiq
« Reply #5 on: January 28, 2016, 11:20:02 PM »
Like 'Taha Syed' said, many of these 'miracle books' were forgeries made in the 1500 and 1600s (coincidentally when Shiaism became the state religion of Iran). I know in Hayat al-Quloob, their is a hadis saying that black people were made as a punishment and to be the slaves of white people.

I thought shia "only" has racist narrations about arab & kurd. Can you please quote the exact wording here? Should post it to african shia forum :D

Bolani Muslim

Re: Sunni imam about Jaafar Al-Sadiq
« Reply #6 on: January 29, 2016, 02:09:06 AM »
I thought shia "only" has racist narrations about arab & kurd. Can you please quote the exact wording here? Should post it to african shia forum :D
One minute, it's gonna be in another thread titled 'Bolani's Review of Hayat al-Quloob Vol 1'

 

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