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The story of Fadak!

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Ameen

The story of Fadak!
« on: December 14, 2014, 04:25:23 AM »
Did The Prophet (Pbuh) Present The Land To Fatimah (sa) ?

The Prophet (pbuh) in his life time with the instructions from Allah the almighty presented this Land to Hazrath Fatimah (sa), as is found in the Commentary of the respected Sunni Scholar, Jalaluddin al-Suyuti. Here is the historical background for the Land of Fadak, and after that is the text for the Tafseer for the Verse 26 Chapter XVII.

Imam ‘Ali (as) was sent to Fadak, a Jewish town not far from Khaibar to take it. But, before the use of any force, the inhabitants tendered their submission, ceding half of their property to the prophet (pbuh). When the Angel Gabriel revealed to the Prophet the Divine Command as in the Verse 26 of Chapter XVII (17)

"And give unto one who is of Kin (to thee) that which is due”(17:26)

and the Prophet (pbuh) asked as to who was meant as "being of Kin". the Angel named Hazrath Fatimah (sa) and told the Prophet (pbuh) to give Fadak to her (as), as the Income from Fadak belonged wholly to him on account of its being ceded to him without the use of force. the Prophet (pbuh) accordingly bestowed upon Hazrath Fatimah (sa) his estate of Fadak for the subsistence of herself and her children.

With reference to the above Qur’anic Verse, many Sunni commentators have written that:

when the Verse was revealed, the Holy Prophet (Pbuh) asked the Angel Gabriel: "Who are the Kinsmen and what is their due?”The Angel Gibrael replied "Give Fadak to Fatimah for it is her due, and whatever is due to Allah and the Prophet (Pbuh) out of Fadak, that also belongs to her, so entrust to her also."

The above is narrated through al Bazzar, Abu Yala, Ibn Abi Hatim, Ibn Marduwayh and others from Abu Said al Khudri and through Ibn Marduwayh from Abdullah ibn al Abbas for the above verse.

Sunni references:

- Tafsir Durr al-Mansur, v4, p177
- Kanz al-Ummal, v2, p158
- Sawaiq al Muhriqah Chapter 15 p 21-22
- Rozatul Safaa vol 2 p 135
- Sharah e Muwaqif p 735
- Tareekh Ahmadi p45
- Ruh al ma’ani, vol 15 p 62

It leaves no room for us to believe that the Land of Fadak was not the personal belonging of Hazrath Fatimah (sa)!

Historians also write that

Certainly, Abu Bakar (ra) snatched Fadak from Fatimah (sa)

Sunni references:

- Sharah, vol 16 p 219

- Wafa al Wafa (as Samhudi), vol 3 p1000

- Sawaiq al Muhriqah, p 32

If anybody claims that the above story is no where to be found in the hadith books, I would like you to refer to these books, that are termed as authentic and reliable by the Sunni scholars that contains the very event that you have had mentioned.

- Commentary of the Qur’an by Fakhr al-Din al-Razi , v8, p125 (Under the Tafseer of Surah Hashr)
- Sawaiq al-Muhriqah by Ibn Hajar Haythmi, p21

Fatimah (sa) raised a voice when Fadak was stolen from her, protesting to Abu Bakar (ra), she said:

You have taken over possesion of Fadak although the Prophet had gifted it to me during his life time.

On this Abu Bakar (ra) asked her to produce witnesses of the gift. Consequently, Imam ‘Ali (as) and Umm Ayman gave evidence on her favor. Umm Ayman was the freed bond maid and the dry nurse for the Holy Prophet (pbuh), She was the mother of Usamah ibn Zayd ibn al Harith. The Holy Prophet (pbuh) usted to say Umm Ayman is my mother after my mother. The Holy Prophet (pbuh) also bore witness that she is among the people of paradise.

Sunni references:

- al Mustadrak, vol 4 p 63
- History of Tabari, vol 3 p 3460
- al Istiab, vol 4 p 1793
- Usud al Ghabah, vol 5 p 567
- Tabaqat, vol 8 p 192
- al Isabah, vol 4 p 432

Ameen

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #1 on: December 14, 2014, 04:38:34 AM »
One thing I would like you people to answer is that when the Muhajir and Ansar gathered in Sakeefa and the meeting took place to select someone to lead the Ummah and the result of that meeting was Hazrath Abu Bakar (ra) was selected and elected as leader and the new administration was formed, where did the funds come from to run the government and the Muslim army???? Where did the money come from to run state affairs??? Was the sight not set on Fadak??? Obviously to run government the money/funds/ income has to come from some where. So if it was not Fadak then how did they run government, the army and the state affairs??????????????????????? Where did the money come from???

Taha

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2014, 06:00:53 AM »
Abu Bakar (ra)

I thought you were a Shi`ah???? :o

Hani

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #3 on: December 14, 2014, 03:41:09 PM »
One thing I would like you people to answer is that when the Muhajir and Ansar gathered in Sakeefa and the meeting took place to select someone to lead the Ummah and the result of that meeting was Hazrath Abu Bakar (ra) was selected and elected as leader and the new administration was formed, where did the funds come from to run the government and the Muslim army? ??? Where did the money come from to run state affairs??? Was the sight not set on Fadak??? Obviously to run government the money/funds/ income has to come from some where. So if it was not Fadak then how did they run government, the army and the state affairs? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ? Where did the money come from???


I'm gonna answer this one cause it's new Haha = )


Fadak was acquired during the battles of Khaybar which took place in the year 7 AH.


The Prophet (saw) had many conquests and battles during his life and he died in 11 AH.


Starting from the events of al-Abwa' which happened in 2 AH, the Muslims were involved in plenty of battles against their enemies before "Fadak" was acquired.


My answer is, they didn't need Fadak because it wasn't the only source to fund the Muslims, there were plenty of other ways that they funded the armies.


I add, if Fadak was the only source of funding as you claim, why'd he give it to Fatimah thus depriving the nation of an essential resource and key to military success?


Also, if Fadak belonged to Fatimah during the life of the Prophet (saw), no one had a right to take from it to fund the army, which means the Muslims remained during his life without any funding because the Prophet (saw) handed the only means of income to his daughter.


(Which is selfish No?)
عَلامَةُ أَهْلِ الْبِدَعِ الْوَقِيعَةُ فِي أَهْلِ الأَثَرِ. وَعَلامَةُ الْجَهْمِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُشَبِّهَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الْقَدَرِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُجَبِّرَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الزَّنَادِقَةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ الأَثَرِ حَشْوِيَّةً

Religion = simple & clear

Hani

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2014, 03:55:24 PM »
I like this part of your piece the most:



Quote

Historians also write that


Certainly, Abu Bakar (ra) snatched Fadak from Fatimah (sa)


Sunni references:


- Sharah, vol 16 p 219


- Wafa al Wafa (as Samhudi), vol 3 p1000


- Sawaiq al Muhriqah, p 32


These Sunni scholars must really hate Abu Bakr hehe... If they wrote in their books that he CERTAINLY SNATCHED Fadak from Fatimah (as).


I'm sure you're providing us with some accurate information brother, I want to ask about one thing though, in the Sunni sources, the first source is called "Sharah", may I ask who the author of this book is?



عَلامَةُ أَهْلِ الْبِدَعِ الْوَقِيعَةُ فِي أَهْلِ الأَثَرِ. وَعَلامَةُ الْجَهْمِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُشَبِّهَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الْقَدَرِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُجَبِّرَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الزَّنَادِقَةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ الأَثَرِ حَشْوِيَّةً

Religion = simple & clear

Ameen

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #5 on: December 14, 2014, 04:57:40 PM »
I am starting work at te moment. Insha'allah I will get back to you. But I love the "HA HA and the HEE HEE" from you. For me this is just  a discussion and in general but from you boys I know it is grievance and personal. Your attitude and the way you boys respond shows it all. Just digest this for the moment that Muhammad Ibne Isma'eel Al Bukhari what was his views on Shias??? Do some home work on this and then you will find certain narrations which he rejected because he didn't see them authentic enough but the ones he did are in his collection of The book Bukhari, which has been labelled not just "Sehih Bukhar"i but is labelled "Sehih Bukhari Baad zs kithaab e Bar". From here I wil put many narrations which go against or do not fall in favour of the companions. What are you going to do here???  Areyou going to do the same and question the reputation and Aqeedah of Bukhari himself????

Ameen

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #6 on: December 14, 2014, 05:03:03 PM »
I like this part of your piece the most:



Quote

Historians also write that


Certainly, Abu Bakar (ra) snatched Fadak from Fatimah (sa)


Sunni references:


- Sharah, vol 16 p 219


- Wafa al Wafa (as Samhudi), vol 3 p1000


- Sawaiq al Muhriqah, p 32


These Sunni scholars must really hate Abu Bakr hehe... If they wrote in their books that he CERTAINLY SNATCHED Fadak from Fatimah (as).


I'm sure you're providing us with some accurate information brother, I want to ask about one thing though, in the Sunni sources, the first source is called "Sharah", may I ask who the author of this book is?


It's not your fault that you are programmed to think one way. For you it"s just about love and hate and then see and take everything on such basis. They are Ahle Sunnah well known scholars and those are Ahle SUnnah authentic books. Now there is something called research, putting both arguments forward, seeing and looking at things with an open mind etc.

Hani

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #7 on: December 14, 2014, 05:30:09 PM »
I am starting work at te moment. Insha'allah I will get back to you. But I love the "HA HA and the HEE HEE" from you. For me this is just  a discussion and in general but from you boys I know it is grievance and personal. Your attitude and the way you boys respond shows it all. Just digest this for the moment that Muhammad Ibne Isma'eel Al Bukhari what was his views on Shias???


I see the Hahas and Hehes are getting to you, try to ignore them and stick to topic : )
عَلامَةُ أَهْلِ الْبِدَعِ الْوَقِيعَةُ فِي أَهْلِ الأَثَرِ. وَعَلامَةُ الْجَهْمِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُشَبِّهَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الْقَدَرِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُجَبِّرَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الزَّنَادِقَةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ الأَثَرِ حَشْوِيَّةً

Religion = simple & clear

Hani

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2014, 05:35:10 PM »

It's not your fault that you are programmed to think one way. For you it"s just about love and hate and then see and take everything on such basis. They are Ahle Sunnah well known scholars and those are Ahle SUnnah authentic books. Now there is something called research, putting both arguments forward, seeing and looking at things with an open mind etc.


You're quoting from a book, don't you know who its author is? I asked you a simple question brother. Answer me as far as this Sunni source called "Sharah".


As for al-Wafa and al-Sawa`iq, I'd like to know WHERE they wrote "Certainly, Abu Bakar (ra) snatched Fadak from Fatimah (sa)."


Can you provide the Arabic texts of these statements? Otherwise, they're unacceptable in this format you presented, and IF it should turn out that they never said such things, then do you prefer to be accused of "Lying" or "Ignorance"?

عَلامَةُ أَهْلِ الْبِدَعِ الْوَقِيعَةُ فِي أَهْلِ الأَثَرِ. وَعَلامَةُ الْجَهْمِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُشَبِّهَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الْقَدَرِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُجَبِّرَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الزَّنَادِقَةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ الأَثَرِ حَشْوِيَّةً

Religion = simple & clear

Ameen

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #9 on: December 14, 2014, 08:39:03 PM »
I am starting work at te moment. Insha'allah I will get back to you. But I love the "HA HA and the HEE HEE" from you. For me this is just  a discussion and in general but from you boys I know it is grievance and personal. Your attitude and the way you boys respond shows it all. Just digest this for the moment that Muhammad Ibne Isma'eel Al Bukhari what was his views on Shias???


I see the Hahas and Hehes are getting to you, try to ignore them and stick to topic : )

Nothing is getting to me. This is where you are wrong as well as many other places. Pointing something out or ones behaviour and attitude, doesn't mean it's getting to you. Have an open mind to and about things. Ignore them and stick to the topic??? LOL! Why don't you stick to the topic in the first place and keep everything that is off topic out??? Start to practice what you preech!

MuslimK

  • *****
  • Total likes: 255
  • +11/-0
  • یا مقلب القلوب ثبت قلبی علی دینک
    • Refuting Shia allegations everywhere
  • Religion: Sunni
Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #10 on: December 14, 2014, 10:59:15 PM »

I thought you were a Shi`ah???? :o

He is a Shia. He even use ra for Muawiyah.

I don't know the reason :)
در خلافت میل نیست ای بی‌خبر
میل کی آید ز بوبکر و عمر
میل اگر بودی در آن دو مقتدا
هر دو کردندی پسر را پیشوا

عطار نِیشابوری

www.Nahjul-Balagha.net | www.TwelverShia.net | www.ghadirkhumm.com

MuslimK

  • *****
  • Total likes: 255
  • +11/-0
  • یا مقلب القلوب ثبت قلبی علی دینک
    • Refuting Shia allegations everywhere
  • Religion: Sunni
Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #11 on: December 14, 2014, 11:26:38 PM »
اسلام علیکم


They are Ahle Sunnah well known scholars and those are Ahle Sunnah authentic books. Now there is something called research, putting both arguments forward, seeing and looking at things with an open mind etc.

Have you really done your research? Then name the author of the book 'Sharah' and quote Arabic texts for other references. If you can't do that then tell us. Nothing wrong with it.  After all we are humans and make mistake.


You're quoting from a book, don't you know who its author is? I asked you a simple question brother. Answer me as far as this Sunni source called "Sharah".


As for al-Wafa and al-Sawa`iq, I'd like to know WHERE they wrote "Certainly, Abu Bakar (ra) snatched Fadak from Fatimah (sa)."


Can you provide the Arabic texts of these statements? Otherwise, they're unacceptable in this format you presented, and IF it should turn out that they never said such things, then do you prefer to be accused of "Lying" or "Ignorance"?

+1
در خلافت میل نیست ای بی‌خبر
میل کی آید ز بوبکر و عمر
میل اگر بودی در آن دو مقتدا
هر دو کردندی پسر را پیشوا

عطار نِیشابوری

www.Nahjul-Balagha.net | www.TwelverShia.net | www.ghadirkhumm.com

Hani

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #12 on: December 14, 2014, 11:27:37 PM »

Nothing is getting to me. This is where you are wrong as well as many other places. Pointing something out or ones behaviour and attitude, doesn't mean it's getting to you. Have an open mind to and about things. Ignore them and stick to the topic??? LOL! Why don't you stick to the topic in the first place and keep everything that is off topic out??? Start to practice what you preech!


I said that because you keep quoting them and commenting on them, they catch your attention, this isn't the first time you do it.


As for "off-topic", let me quote to you what you said:


Quote
Just digest this for the moment that Muhammad Ibne Isma'eel Al Bukhari what was his views on Shias??? Do some home work on this and then you will find certain narrations which he rejected because he didn't see them authentic enough but the ones he did are in his collection of The book Bukhari, which has been labelled not just "Sehih Bukhar"i but is labelled "Sehih Bukhari Baad zs kithaab e Bar". What are you going to do here???  Areyou going to do the same and question the reputation and Aqeedah of Bukhari himself?


You're "off topic" because we're talking about Fadak, we don't care about Bukhari's view on Shia or Bukhari's `Aqeedah, or the authenticity of his book, it's all off topic.
عَلامَةُ أَهْلِ الْبِدَعِ الْوَقِيعَةُ فِي أَهْلِ الأَثَرِ. وَعَلامَةُ الْجَهْمِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُشَبِّهَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الْقَدَرِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُجَبِّرَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الزَّنَادِقَةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ الأَثَرِ حَشْوِيَّةً

Religion = simple & clear

Husayn

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #13 on: December 14, 2014, 11:28:49 PM »

It's not your fault that you are programmed to think one way. For you it"s just about love and hate and then see and take everything on such basis. They are Ahle Sunnah well known scholars and those are Ahle SUnnah authentic books. Now there is something called research, putting both arguments forward, seeing and looking at things with an open mind etc.


You're quoting from a book, don't you know who its author is? I asked you a simple question brother. Answer me as far as this Sunni source called "Sharah".

Can I answer?

*raises hand*

Pick me! Pick me!

Oh what the hell - is it "Sharah" Nahjul Balagha by the "Sunni" scholar Ibn Abi al-Hadid?

I like how the great Shia scholar who wrote this article has disguised it so well.
إن يتبعون إلا الظن وما تهوى الأنفس

Hani

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #14 on: December 14, 2014, 11:30:57 PM »

Have you really done your research? Then name the author of the book 'Sharah'



By the way, I know the book's full name and the name of its author and his Madhab, I just want to hear it from him.


(He's not Sunni)
عَلامَةُ أَهْلِ الْبِدَعِ الْوَقِيعَةُ فِي أَهْلِ الأَثَرِ. وَعَلامَةُ الْجَهْمِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُشَبِّهَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الْقَدَرِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُجَبِّرَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الزَّنَادِقَةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ الأَثَرِ حَشْوِيَّةً

Religion = simple & clear

Hani

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #15 on: December 14, 2014, 11:32:08 PM »

Can I answer?

*raises hand*

Pick me! Pick me!

Oh what the hell - is it "Sharah" Nahjul Balagha by the "Sunni" scholar Ibn Abi al-Hadid?

I like how the great Shia scholar who wrote this article has disguised it so well.


Hahaha, there you go, that's him, the Mu`tazili Shi`ee.
عَلامَةُ أَهْلِ الْبِدَعِ الْوَقِيعَةُ فِي أَهْلِ الأَثَرِ. وَعَلامَةُ الْجَهْمِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُشَبِّهَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الْقَدَرِيَّةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ السُّنَّةِ مُجَبِّرَةً. وَعَلامَةُ الزَّنَادِقَةِ أَنْ يُسَمُّوا أَهْلَ الأَثَرِ حَشْوِيَّةً

Religion = simple & clear

Ameen

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #16 on: December 14, 2014, 11:36:44 PM »
Just got a few minutes before i finish my break.   Brothers Khoursani and Taha, to be a shia is it compulsory not to put (ra) with companions of the Prophet (pbuh)??? Is it among the Shia principals, rules and regulations that certain companions of the Prophet (pbuh) have to be spoken about and discussed in this particular manner only??? Everybody has their own language, tone and way they want to use when speaking about certain individuals. This is mine. The moderators and certain members of this forum and especially the Haq Char Yaar forum, who are you me or anyone else to decide who is what and who isn't what. Each and every individual knows who and what they are. We can call whp ever we want what ever we want. But calling someone by any particular name or giving someone our desired identity, doesn't make that person become that.

Husayn

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #17 on: December 15, 2014, 12:15:01 AM »
Just got a few minutes before i finish my break.   Brothers Khoursani and Taha, to be a shia is it compulsory not to put (ra) with companions of the Prophet (pbuh)??? Is it among the Shia principals, rules and regulations that certain companions of the Prophet (pbuh) have to be spoken about and discussed in this particular manner only??? Everybody has their own language, tone and way they want to use when speaking about certain individuals. This is mine. The moderators and certain members of this forum and especially the Haq Char Yaar forum, who are you me or anyone else to decide who is what and who isn't what. Each and every individual knows who and what they are. We can call whp ever we want what ever we want. But calling someone by any particular name or giving someone our desired identity, doesn't make that person become that.

See what we mean when we say that every different Shia person has their own set of beliefs?

Yes, to be a "Shia" is to curse the companions, especially Abu Bakr (ra) - its called Tabarra, or haven't you heard of it?
إن يتبعون إلا الظن وما تهوى الأنفس

Ameen

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #18 on: December 15, 2014, 01:45:36 AM »
Just got a few minutes before i finish my break.   Brothers Khoursani and Taha, to be a shia is it compulsory not to put (ra) with companions of the Prophet (pbuh)??? Is it among the Shia principals, rules and regulations that certain companions of the Prophet (pbuh) have to be spoken about and discussed in this particular manner only??? Everybody has their own language, tone and way they want to use when speaking about certain individuals. This is mine. The moderators and certain members of this forum and especially the Haq Char Yaar forum, who are you me or anyone else to decide who is what and who isn't what. Each and every individual knows who and what they are. We can call whp ever we want what ever we want. But calling someone by any particular name or giving someone our desired identity, doesn't make that person become that.

See what we mean when we say that every different Shia person has their own set of beliefs?

Yes, to be a "Shia" is to curse the companions, especially Abu Bakr (ra) - its called Tabarra, or haven't you heard of it?

I would love to answer this but i will get accused of going off topic. Brpther Hani won't be saying anything to you. So you can carry on as long as you like and wish.

Ameen

Re: The story of Fadak!
« Reply #19 on: December 15, 2014, 01:50:46 AM »

Can I answer?

*raises hand*

Pick me! Pick me!

Oh what the hell - is it "Sharah" Nahjul Balagha by the "Sunni" scholar Ibn Abi al-Hadid?

I like how the great Shia scholar who wrote this article has disguised it so well.


Hahaha, there you go, that's him, the Mu`tazili Shi`ee.

So Mr ha ha ha and hee hee hee, are you npt going off topic here??? Ooops, you're the global mpderator, you're incharge, so you can't  be going wrong a ywhere.

 

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